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[Music]

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hey everyone welcome to the show i'm

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martin willis your host and another i'm

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excited about the show tonight we have

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robert salas coming up he he was

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involved in an incident

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in maelstrom air force base that

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involved nuclear warheads and this is

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back

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in 1967

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and he's doing a fundraiser he's really

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close to meeting his goal of his

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fundraiser i hope this podcast can help

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push that over the edge i donated and i

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know that not everyone is able to to

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donate a lot of people are still having

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you know issues out of work things like

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that but if you happen to have the means

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and you want to help a good cause that

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information is down in the show links

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and down in youtube or facebook wherever

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you're watching this show you can see

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how to how to participate if you would

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like to

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so uh what a week i'm going to share

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this

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a congressional bill passed with an

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amendment

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that was actually pushed through by

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ruben gallego

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act

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that was uh is involving the uaps and

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basically what's going to happen is the

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uap task force is going to uh terminate

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i think immediately or within 180 days

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from now

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and then but there is a permanent um

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there's going to be a permanent office

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that's going to be set up

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and this is all involved

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our government looking hard at this

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situation of uaps ufos whatever you want

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to call them uh i think it's a major

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major deal now we haven't heard i know

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uh lou ella hunt uh luella hondo

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elizondo that is is absolutely thrilled

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i watched a video with him that this has

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happened i think you know he indeed had

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a part of it

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and by the way lou is actually uh he's

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actually writing a book he announced

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that the other day i've been in touch

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with his wife about this and um he is

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like i mentioned before is coming up in

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december

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but he's been working really hard on a

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book and i think that's great that he's

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doing that

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i'm really uh an advocate for uh lou

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elizondo i think he's done a lot

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a lot for the field he's given up a lot

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and given a lot of himself

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to help things like this congressional

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bill

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um to getting to get past uh robert

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salus is going to be talking about his

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efforts as well to move the needle

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forward we'll be bringing him in a

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minute in in a minute and uh i didn't

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mention this but last

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uh well two weekends ago now a friend of

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mine and i went to pine bush we had a

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blast we met bill there

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um i was on a panel with richard dolan

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and uh

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lee spiegel and mark d'antonio and we

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had we had a really fun time and on the

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break um if you're watching live i'm

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going to play a little clip by linda

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zimmerman about what she thinks about

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what's going on in the pine bush area

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so make sure you check out that

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congressional bill um i have links on my

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website when it um that will take you

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right to the pdf

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and also write to uh representative

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ruben gallagher's uh website about his

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announcement his press release about

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getting that thing passed which i'm

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absolutely thrilled about again

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you don't hear much about it in the

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media but

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we should be getting

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a an annual report i did reach out to

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find out if that is going to be a

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public report i'm sure i sure hope it is

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and uh hopefully we'll find

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that information out once i find that

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out i will of course announce that but i

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want to thank everyone that helps out

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with the show anyone can do that if you

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choose to that information is over

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on

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podcastufo.com you'll see a

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on the menu bar it'll say support the

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show

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and our uh blog this weekend i mean uh

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came up this weekend uh from charles

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lear

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is called a ufo invasion in england and

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this is a he talks about um what has

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happened

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uh starting back in 1967 some amazing

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you know saucer-shaped objects and etc

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etc as always i thank charles a lot for

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all his hard work he does on a weekly

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basis those are audio blogs as well

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and our facebook page is still uh

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active with people we are uh we need to

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post more on that we had peggy has semi

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retired from that so i'm looking to

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probably uh get some more posting done

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on that in the future

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now i would like to also uh announce i

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just said a minute ago that

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about uh the during the break there's

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about a three minute break or so

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and i had this idea where

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i think i would like to talk to

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some of you listeners out there who have

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had ufo sightings and kind of fill in

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those three minute gaps each week and

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record prior to and

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so if you're interested in that just

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email me at martin at podcastufo.com

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and we'll go from there but it i think

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would be a good idea to post up some ufo

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incidents i'm trying to get

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a friend from australia that had an

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incident when she was a child i talk

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about it it's a triangle that went

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overhead that uh

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she felt like there was pressure her and

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her grandmother was almost like forced

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down to the ground this is a while back

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and a very interesting one at that so

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enough of me blabbering away here we're

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going to bring robert salison

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hi robert welcome to the show

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hi martin uh it's great to be with you i

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think uh

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we met uh what uh

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seven years ago something like this

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something like that yes i remember the

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last time you were on my show you said

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well i think i'm not going to do a show

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for a while i remember

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i think that was the attitude you know

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what you had at the time but

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i've said that many times

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and

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well as soon as i'm off air my wife

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kicks me in the butt and says uh get

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back on there

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oh

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yeah that's a good lady you got there i

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have to take orders from the boss that's

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right that's right

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now i'd like to uh well first of all i'd

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like to say to you that um before we get

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into what you're trying to accomplish

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uh there are uh new listeners constantly

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that may not be familiar with your story

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so um you know we got a half hour here

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if you wanna uh go over exactly what

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happened it's a fascinating story and i

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i never get tired of hearing it so if

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you would a little bit about your

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background and what happened back in

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1967

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i was uh what's called a missile combat

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crew

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on missile combat i was a

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deputy at first uh when this incident i

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was a deputy and then

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later became a commander of the crew but

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i was on alert status with my commander

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fred mywald

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we are underground facility

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about 60 feet underground and then we

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had about six guards

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up

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top side

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we were locked in for 24 hours and our

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our job was basically to

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make sure the missiles were

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operating and on alert status and

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we would uh

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launch if given the order

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so uh we had 10 missiles under our

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command these were men of man one

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uh it was

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uh well i won't go into details of the

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missile other was an intercontinental

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ballistic missile

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um

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so first i get a call from my top side

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guard saying that there's strange lights

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in the sky

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flying very fast

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not making any sound

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stopping on a dime

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almost instantaneously

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making right angle turns uh

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and he couldn't explain them as aircraft

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he just wanted to report this

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they were still quite high up but

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uh he could

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easily see them he and the other

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uh security guards

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were out there watching him

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and i even said you mean something like

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ufos and

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i just have joking and he uh he said

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well i can't explain it sir there are

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not airplanes uh no

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nothing like i've ever seen so

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i kind of uh

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i didn't take it too seriously at that

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time i was not interested in the subject

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even though we have had have

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reports in the great falls tribune

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from

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citizens reporting lights in the sky and

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uh these were reports or

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that had been in the newspapers

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anyway i i simply discounted it thanked

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him and hung up the phone

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and then about five minutes later he

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calls back this time he's extremely

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frightened uh he's shouting into the

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phone he was uh

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i couldn't make out what he was saying

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at first uh he was just

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blabbering um

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and frightened

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said he had all the guards finally

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calmed him down he said

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i've got all the guards on here sir

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there there's a

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glowing red object

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pulsating and

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hovering right above us uh right above

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the front gate

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uh he wanted me to tell him what to do

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next

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um

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by this time i i realized we were under

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some sort of uh

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attack because of uh

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how he presented the situation

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all the guards had their weapons drawn

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and this thing was just frightening to

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them

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i simply said make sure nothing comes in

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the

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um

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then he hung up the phone

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uh

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i went over to tell my commander about

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the phone calls he was taking a rest

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break we had a little cut down there

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uh then all of a sudden the missiles

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started

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going off alert got

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lots of bells and whistles going off and

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the

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lights on our control panel were turning

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from green to red meaning no go they

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could not be launched

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i went through our procedures

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and

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had a way of determining what the

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problem was

285
00:11:43,910 --> 00:11:40,320
uh and all the missiles were reading out

286
00:11:46,389 --> 00:11:43,920
a guidance and control system failure

287
00:11:48,710 --> 00:11:46,399
so without proper guidance

288
00:11:50,310 --> 00:11:48,720
this the missiles could not be launched

289
00:11:51,670 --> 00:11:50,320
um

290
00:11:55,110 --> 00:11:51,680
man that

291
00:11:57,430 --> 00:11:55,120
then he we also had two

292
00:12:00,550 --> 00:11:57,440
launch facilities that had incursion

293
00:12:06,150 --> 00:12:03,269
possibility of security breach

294
00:12:09,509 --> 00:12:06,160
at two of the launch facilities

295
00:12:11,509 --> 00:12:09,519
so i had to call back and send guards

296
00:12:13,590 --> 00:12:11,519
first of course i asked if the object

297
00:12:15,670 --> 00:12:13,600
was still up there he said no it just

298
00:12:18,710 --> 00:12:15,680
flown off

299
00:12:20,150 --> 00:12:18,720
but the object was up there when these

300
00:12:23,670 --> 00:12:20,160
missiles

301
00:12:29,509 --> 00:12:26,870
so i ordered them out to the these two

302
00:12:31,910 --> 00:12:29,519
facilities where we had these

303
00:12:34,230 --> 00:12:31,920
uh security lights

304
00:12:36,230 --> 00:12:34,240
uh and they reported back to my

305
00:12:38,389 --> 00:12:36,240
commander that um

306
00:12:40,069 --> 00:12:38,399
i actually reported back to the security

307
00:12:42,230 --> 00:12:40,079
guard that um

308
00:12:44,949 --> 00:12:42,240
they'd seen the objects again

309
00:12:46,150 --> 00:12:44,959
over the launch facilities

310
00:12:47,509 --> 00:12:46,160
so

311
00:12:49,670 --> 00:12:47,519
and then

312
00:12:51,350 --> 00:12:49,680
after i got rid of

313
00:12:53,590 --> 00:12:51,360
hung up from that phone call my

314
00:12:55,269 --> 00:12:53,600
commander turns to me and says

315
00:12:56,470 --> 00:12:55,279
the same thing happened then another

316
00:12:59,350 --> 00:12:56,480
flight

317
00:13:03,350 --> 00:12:59,360
now i thought he meant that evening but

318
00:13:05,829 --> 00:13:03,360
in fact later on i realized it was

319
00:13:08,230 --> 00:13:05,839
uh it happened

320
00:13:10,949 --> 00:13:08,240
about eight days earlier

321
00:13:13,509 --> 00:13:10,959
and that was the echo flight incident

322
00:13:17,750 --> 00:13:13,519
so we were at oscar flight

323
00:13:20,710 --> 00:13:17,760
echo flight went down march 16th

324
00:13:23,670 --> 00:13:20,720
essentially the same thing happened and

325
00:13:26,949 --> 00:13:23,680
they had the same failure modes

326
00:13:29,350 --> 00:13:26,959
guidance and control system

327
00:13:31,110 --> 00:13:29,360
so within the span of eight days we lost

328
00:13:33,430 --> 00:13:31,120
20

329
00:13:38,550 --> 00:13:33,440
nuclear tipped

330
00:13:42,550 --> 00:13:40,870
that is such an incredible story and

331
00:13:44,550 --> 00:13:42,560
and

332
00:13:45,990 --> 00:13:44,560
the thing of note here is

333
00:13:47,430 --> 00:13:46,000
you know this this thing you're trying

334
00:13:50,069 --> 00:13:47,440
to put together

335
00:13:52,069 --> 00:13:50,079
if if that's not

336
00:13:59,110 --> 00:13:52,079
national security

337
00:14:01,030 --> 00:13:59,120
i mean i can't believe that that would

338
00:14:02,629 --> 00:14:01,040
you know not have a continuous

339
00:14:05,110 --> 00:14:02,639
investigation

340
00:14:07,750 --> 00:14:05,120
until something was solved but let me

341
00:14:09,350 --> 00:14:07,760
let me just uh something comes to mind

342
00:14:11,910 --> 00:14:09,360
as i remember

343
00:14:13,430 --> 00:14:11,920
this and tell me if i'm wrong these

344
00:14:14,949 --> 00:14:13,440
these warheads

345
00:14:16,389 --> 00:14:14,959
were

346
00:14:18,470 --> 00:14:16,399
independently

347
00:14:20,550 --> 00:14:18,480
operated in other words there wasn't one

348
00:14:23,509 --> 00:14:20,560
shutdown system that could shut all them

349
00:14:24,790 --> 00:14:23,519
down they each individually had to be

350
00:14:27,030 --> 00:14:24,800
reset

351
00:14:27,990 --> 00:14:27,040
or they could not be um they could not

352
00:14:29,269 --> 00:14:28,000
be

353
00:14:31,910 --> 00:14:29,279
tapped into

354
00:14:35,030 --> 00:14:31,920
on a group basis is that is that right

355
00:14:37,350 --> 00:14:35,040
oh that's correct uh we had uh

356
00:14:40,310 --> 00:14:37,360
these very thick um

357
00:14:42,310 --> 00:14:40,320
cabling systems uh but the cables went

358
00:14:45,110 --> 00:14:42,320
directly from the capsule to each

359
00:14:47,269 --> 00:14:45,120
missile separately it's not like the

360
00:14:49,269 --> 00:14:47,279
missiles had

361
00:14:51,350 --> 00:14:49,279
were interconnected

362
00:14:54,150 --> 00:14:51,360
now

363
00:14:57,269 --> 00:14:54,160
so what this object would have had to do

364
00:15:00,470 --> 00:14:57,279
was send a particular signal

365
00:15:02,150 --> 00:15:00,480
through 60 feet of earth and concrete

366
00:15:04,069 --> 00:15:02,160
penetrate these

367
00:15:05,590 --> 00:15:04,079
huge cables which were

368
00:15:08,150 --> 00:15:05,600
i'd say

369
00:15:12,069 --> 00:15:08,160
eight inches in diameter

370
00:15:17,030 --> 00:15:12,079
uh which were triply shielded from emi

371
00:15:22,389 --> 00:15:19,030
and send that signal to a particular

372
00:15:25,189 --> 00:15:22,399
part of the guidance system

373
00:15:27,670 --> 00:15:25,199
called the logic coupler

374
00:15:29,509 --> 00:15:27,680
so we had an inertial guidance system uh

375
00:15:32,629 --> 00:15:29,519
meaning um

376
00:15:33,749 --> 00:15:32,639
we didn't have gps time obviously

377
00:15:36,550 --> 00:15:33,759
so

378
00:15:38,790 --> 00:15:36,560
uh we had gyroscopes we had a level

379
00:15:42,310 --> 00:15:38,800
platform

380
00:15:43,910 --> 00:15:42,320
and those gyros of course would uh

381
00:15:44,710 --> 00:15:43,920
send data

382
00:15:55,030 --> 00:15:44,720
uh

383
00:15:56,870 --> 00:15:55,040
large this piece of hardware

384
00:16:01,670 --> 00:15:56,880
would determine the

385
00:16:06,150 --> 00:16:03,670
essentially calculate where the missile

386
00:16:08,389 --> 00:16:06,160
was during flight

387
00:16:10,069 --> 00:16:08,399
and determine uh whether or not any

388
00:16:11,910 --> 00:16:10,079
adjustments need to be made

389
00:16:15,110 --> 00:16:11,920
to go on target so

390
00:16:20,230 --> 00:16:15,120
that was an inertial guidance system and

391
00:16:26,310 --> 00:16:23,110
the result of their interference did was

392
00:16:28,470 --> 00:16:26,320
to upset uh the level

393
00:16:31,749 --> 00:16:28,480
platform of

394
00:16:33,910 --> 00:16:31,759
the inertial guidance system

395
00:16:37,749 --> 00:16:33,920
so that

396
00:16:40,550 --> 00:16:37,759
because of that upset um

397
00:16:43,030 --> 00:16:40,560
this calculation could not be made

398
00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:43,040
so that's why the missile shut down

399
00:16:46,629 --> 00:16:44,560
amazing

400
00:16:48,069 --> 00:16:46,639
there was no damage to the systems no

401
00:16:49,350 --> 00:16:48,079
damage

402
00:16:51,590 --> 00:16:49,360
really wow

403
00:16:54,710 --> 00:16:51,600
you know if that's not like someone

404
00:16:56,310 --> 00:16:54,720
saying hey pay attention here

405
00:16:59,189 --> 00:16:56,320
you know you know

406
00:17:00,310 --> 00:16:59,199
i don't i don't know yeah i mean

407
00:17:02,230 --> 00:17:00,320
of course

408
00:17:05,429 --> 00:17:02,240
you can only think like a human can

409
00:17:07,270 --> 00:17:05,439
think so you try to figure things out

410
00:17:11,110 --> 00:17:07,280
the only way we know how

411
00:17:13,750 --> 00:17:11,120
and that is you know why was this done

412
00:17:15,429 --> 00:17:13,760
um if if let's just say they're

413
00:17:18,630 --> 00:17:15,439
extraterrestrial because

414
00:17:20,630 --> 00:17:18,640
i don't know what they are but still we

415
00:17:21,990 --> 00:17:20,640
currently probably do not have the

416
00:17:25,029 --> 00:17:22,000
technology

417
00:17:28,069 --> 00:17:25,039
right now to bring back to 1967 to do

418
00:17:30,150 --> 00:17:28,079
that same exact thing to it like to the

419
00:17:31,110 --> 00:17:30,160
russians or to china or something like

420
00:17:34,870 --> 00:17:31,120
that

421
00:17:38,390 --> 00:17:34,880
no um you know again my argument is if

422
00:17:40,390 --> 00:17:38,400
if we had that technology then in 1967

423
00:17:42,230 --> 00:17:40,400
or the russians had that

424
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:42,240
technology they would certainly have

425
00:17:46,230 --> 00:17:44,480
advertised that

426
00:17:47,190 --> 00:17:46,240
as a way of uh

427
00:17:48,950 --> 00:17:47,200
you know

428
00:17:49,990 --> 00:17:48,960
saying that

429
00:17:52,150 --> 00:17:50,000
uh

430
00:17:54,070 --> 00:17:52,160
you know we could shut you down anytime

431
00:17:55,590 --> 00:17:54,080
yeah that mean that's that's second best

432
00:17:57,350 --> 00:17:55,600
to having

433
00:17:59,110 --> 00:17:57,360
nuclear arms in the first place is to

434
00:18:01,430 --> 00:17:59,120
being able to shut down

435
00:18:04,549 --> 00:18:01,440
your opponent you know

436
00:18:08,070 --> 00:18:04,559
yeah so it's totally this this it's

437
00:18:10,870 --> 00:18:08,080
still from the first time i ever heard

438
00:18:13,110 --> 00:18:10,880
about this it's it totally fascinated me

439
00:18:14,390 --> 00:18:13,120
and it's not just you you said you know

440
00:18:15,190 --> 00:18:14,400
eight days earlier there was something

441
00:18:16,630 --> 00:18:15,200
else

442
00:18:18,230 --> 00:18:16,640
and uh

443
00:18:20,630 --> 00:18:18,240
i mentioned off air that i had something

444
00:18:21,909 --> 00:18:20,640
to tell you and it's it's not going too

445
00:18:23,590 --> 00:18:21,919
far but

446
00:18:24,950 --> 00:18:23,600
we had a guest on

447
00:18:28,150 --> 00:18:24,960
two weeks ago

448
00:18:30,150 --> 00:18:28,160
uh david marceau and he was involved in

449
00:18:32,870 --> 00:18:30,160
the reservists up in

450
00:18:35,270 --> 00:18:32,880
canada he told a story and then

451
00:18:37,990 --> 00:18:35,280
in conversation he said oh by the way i

452
00:18:39,029 --> 00:18:38,000
have a friend whose aunt said that her

453
00:18:40,630 --> 00:18:39,039
husband

454
00:18:45,830 --> 00:18:40,640
his friend's uncle

455
00:18:50,630 --> 00:18:47,909
interruption by a ufo

456
00:18:53,590 --> 00:18:50,640
in the 1960s and he's too scared to talk

457
00:18:55,270 --> 00:18:53,600
about it so um which i think is really

458
00:18:57,909 --> 00:18:55,280
interesting i've been

459
00:18:59,990 --> 00:18:57,919
i've been in contact with david and kind

460
00:19:01,909 --> 00:19:00,000
of trying to push him

461
00:19:04,630 --> 00:19:01,919
to see if he could push

462
00:19:05,750 --> 00:19:04,640
this guy could push his uncle to talk

463
00:19:07,590 --> 00:19:05,760
and um

464
00:19:10,390 --> 00:19:07,600
well because not and i said not not to

465
00:19:12,870 --> 00:19:10,400
me necessarily or not on air but to talk

466
00:19:14,470 --> 00:19:12,880
to someone like you know robert hastings

467
00:19:17,190 --> 00:19:14,480
who i understand is not doing all that

468
00:19:19,590 --> 00:19:17,200
well right now unfortunately but um but

469
00:19:21,110 --> 00:19:19,600
to talk to someone like that to get this

470
00:19:24,150 --> 00:19:21,120
information out there i think is very

471
00:19:27,350 --> 00:19:24,160
important and to speak to you of course

472
00:19:29,750 --> 00:19:27,360
you know well i could uh

473
00:19:31,590 --> 00:19:29,760
i could name about 10 others in the same

474
00:19:33,669 --> 00:19:31,600
boat

475
00:19:36,150 --> 00:19:33,679
that do not want to talk about it do not

476
00:19:38,870 --> 00:19:36,160
want to talk about it

477
00:19:40,390 --> 00:19:38,880
no for various reasons uh one of course

478
00:19:42,390 --> 00:19:40,400
is ridicule but

479
00:19:45,750 --> 00:19:42,400
uh other reasons like uh

480
00:19:47,909 --> 00:19:45,760
you know losing employment or um

481
00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:47,919
affecting it's a it would affect their

482
00:19:52,150 --> 00:19:50,080
families uh who are trying to develop

483
00:19:53,830 --> 00:19:52,160
their own careers and

484
00:19:56,549 --> 00:19:53,840
things like that

485
00:19:58,070 --> 00:19:56,559
this is a difficult thing

486
00:20:00,390 --> 00:19:58,080
now if

487
00:20:01,830 --> 00:20:00,400
if and when there is disclosure and the

488
00:20:03,990 --> 00:20:01,840
government

489
00:20:06,470 --> 00:20:04,000
starts releasing some of the secrets we

490
00:20:08,549 --> 00:20:06,480
have open hearings which is the

491
00:20:10,789 --> 00:20:08,559
objective of

492
00:20:12,950 --> 00:20:10,799
my uh press conference

493
00:20:15,590 --> 00:20:12,960
uh then i think some of these other

494
00:20:18,390 --> 00:20:15,600
people will come forward for sure

495
00:20:21,270 --> 00:20:18,400
well you know i think i think as time

496
00:20:24,789 --> 00:20:21,280
i'm this is a time that it's becoming

497
00:20:27,830 --> 00:20:24,799
more and more okay um which is

498
00:20:29,110 --> 00:20:27,840
i think is really wonderful um where i

499
00:20:30,789 --> 00:20:29,120
think people are going to start feeling

500
00:20:33,110 --> 00:20:30,799
comfortable we're going to see it's kind

501
00:20:35,590 --> 00:20:33,120
of like slowly breaking everything is

502
00:20:36,870 --> 00:20:35,600
kind of like breaking opening

503
00:20:40,710 --> 00:20:36,880
open to

504
00:20:43,270 --> 00:20:40,720
to uh this not being such a you know

505
00:20:44,789 --> 00:20:43,280
fringe so to speak topic now let's talk

506
00:20:46,390 --> 00:20:44,799
about what you're trying to do here

507
00:20:48,149 --> 00:20:46,400
because you're only

508
00:20:49,590 --> 00:20:48,159
wow you're really close to meeting your

509
00:20:51,510 --> 00:20:49,600
thirteen thousand

510
00:20:53,590 --> 00:20:51,520
dollar goal you're up to eleven thousand

511
00:20:55,510 --> 00:20:53,600
six hundred there's been some uh some

512
00:20:57,350 --> 00:20:55,520
names i looked through the the the

513
00:20:58,789 --> 00:20:57,360
donors in there and you know people have

514
00:21:01,029 --> 00:20:58,799
donated

515
00:21:02,870 --> 00:21:01,039
nice nice chunks of money and but you're

516
00:21:04,310 --> 00:21:02,880
close to it so why don't you talk about

517
00:21:07,029 --> 00:21:04,320
that and what your

518
00:21:08,870 --> 00:21:07,039
you know what your end goal is to

519
00:21:10,549 --> 00:21:08,880
getting this done

520
00:21:12,310 --> 00:21:10,559
right

521
00:21:13,669 --> 00:21:12,320
one of the reasons i started this is

522
00:21:15,830 --> 00:21:13,679
because

523
00:21:20,149 --> 00:21:15,840
of course after the

524
00:21:21,830 --> 00:21:20,159
release of of the report by the uh

525
00:21:24,070 --> 00:21:21,840
chief of intelligence director of

526
00:21:25,270 --> 00:21:24,080
national intelligence

527
00:21:27,669 --> 00:21:25,280
report

528
00:21:30,390 --> 00:21:27,679
even though they mentioned possible

529
00:21:32,950 --> 00:21:30,400
national security implications

530
00:21:34,149 --> 00:21:32,960
they said nothing about

531
00:21:37,750 --> 00:21:34,159
the

532
00:21:41,830 --> 00:21:37,760
many many instances where ufos have been

533
00:21:43,909 --> 00:21:41,840
have interfered with nuclear weapons

534
00:21:45,430 --> 00:21:43,919
the two instances i just talked about

535
00:21:47,909 --> 00:21:45,440
were were just

536
00:21:50,070 --> 00:21:47,919
two of many in fact there was another

537
00:21:52,710 --> 00:21:50,080
one in 66

538
00:21:55,669 --> 00:21:52,720
at minot where all 10 missiles went down

539
00:21:56,950 --> 00:21:55,679
during a ufo encounter so

540
00:22:00,149 --> 00:21:56,960
but

541
00:22:01,990 --> 00:22:00,159
uh so my purpose really

542
00:22:04,549 --> 00:22:02,000
is to bring

543
00:22:07,190 --> 00:22:04,559
forward uh they're gonna be four of us

544
00:22:09,669 --> 00:22:07,200
uh at the national press club

545
00:22:12,549 --> 00:22:09,679
uh on october 19th that's definite it's

546
00:22:14,630 --> 00:22:12,559
a definite date um starting at nine

547
00:22:17,830 --> 00:22:14,640
o'clock in the morning

548
00:22:19,830 --> 00:22:17,840
and we will be streaming live

549
00:22:21,029 --> 00:22:19,840
and we made sure that

550
00:22:22,549 --> 00:22:21,039
um

551
00:22:24,470 --> 00:22:22,559
so everybody

552
00:22:26,470 --> 00:22:24,480
who's got access to a computer will be

553
00:22:27,590 --> 00:22:26,480
able to see it

554
00:22:30,070 --> 00:22:27,600
and

555
00:22:32,549 --> 00:22:30,080
each of us are going to talk about

556
00:22:34,789 --> 00:22:32,559
our various encounters

557
00:22:35,830 --> 00:22:34,799
with ufos

558
00:22:37,669 --> 00:22:35,840
and

559
00:22:41,190 --> 00:22:37,679
hopefully we'll have

560
00:22:42,149 --> 00:22:41,200
plenty of press there

561
00:22:43,830 --> 00:22:42,159
and

562
00:22:47,350 --> 00:22:43,840
we'll answer their questions of course

563
00:22:49,510 --> 00:22:47,360
we'll provide evidence we'll we'll

564
00:22:51,510 --> 00:22:49,520
provide what evidence we have

565
00:22:53,430 --> 00:22:51,520
in my case i think we've got a

566
00:22:54,950 --> 00:22:53,440
substantial amount of evidence that will

567
00:22:58,230 --> 00:22:54,960
support

568
00:23:02,870 --> 00:23:00,470
and the objective of course is to put

569
00:23:04,630 --> 00:23:02,880
pressure on congress to have open

570
00:23:06,830 --> 00:23:04,640
hearings where

571
00:23:08,549 --> 00:23:06,840
more witnesses come forward

572
00:23:09,909 --> 00:23:08,559
um

573
00:23:13,510 --> 00:23:09,919
and

574
00:23:15,990 --> 00:23:13,520
speak in front of the public uh on

575
00:23:18,789 --> 00:23:16,000
national tv in in

576
00:23:19,510 --> 00:23:18,799
in the chambers of congress

577
00:23:22,870 --> 00:23:19,520
so

578
00:23:24,789 --> 00:23:22,880
part of our objective is to go after our

579
00:23:27,590 --> 00:23:24,799
press conference to go visit other

580
00:23:28,789 --> 00:23:27,600
congressmen and senators

581
00:23:30,950 --> 00:23:28,799
and again

582
00:23:33,430 --> 00:23:30,960
urge them

583
00:23:35,510 --> 00:23:33,440
of course brief them on our our stories

584
00:23:38,070 --> 00:23:35,520
but urge them to

585
00:23:40,789 --> 00:23:38,080
hold open hearings

586
00:23:44,630 --> 00:23:40,799
so that's that's the idea

587
00:23:45,830 --> 00:23:44,640
um i was flabbergasted to see so much

588
00:23:48,950 --> 00:23:45,840
support

589
00:23:53,510 --> 00:23:50,470
in in uh

590
00:23:55,750 --> 00:23:53,520
donating money for for this cause and

591
00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:55,760
believe me it's it sounds like a large

592
00:23:59,590 --> 00:23:58,000
sum of money but uh

593
00:24:05,269 --> 00:23:59,600
uh

594
00:24:06,950 --> 00:24:05,279
sum of

595
00:24:08,070 --> 00:24:06,960
uh my goal

596
00:24:09,510 --> 00:24:08,080
um

597
00:24:12,230 --> 00:24:09,520
and

598
00:24:13,990 --> 00:24:12,240
all that money will be spent on on the

599
00:24:15,990 --> 00:24:14,000
press conference so

600
00:24:18,070 --> 00:24:16,000
if anyone does

601
00:24:20,390 --> 00:24:18,080
i want to donate uh

602
00:24:22,230 --> 00:24:20,400
it would be much appreciated and you're

603
00:24:26,070 --> 00:24:22,240
right there have been so many

604
00:24:29,029 --> 00:24:26,080
people that have given generously um

605
00:24:32,070 --> 00:24:29,039
well i think we've had um

606
00:24:34,789 --> 00:24:32,080
uh well over 104

607
00:24:37,669 --> 00:24:34,799
150 donors

608
00:24:40,549 --> 00:24:37,679
and and some have uh

609
00:24:42,149 --> 00:24:40,559
have gone the extra mile i i really

610
00:24:45,190 --> 00:24:42,159
really appreciate that

611
00:24:48,710 --> 00:24:45,200
yeah you guys i noticed a lot of the 500

612
00:24:50,549 --> 00:24:48,720
donors were anonymous which is yeah yeah

613
00:24:51,909 --> 00:24:50,559
and an extra nice

614
00:24:53,750 --> 00:24:51,919
thing if someone's giving without

615
00:24:56,549 --> 00:24:53,760
needing any recognition that's that's

616
00:24:58,630 --> 00:24:56,559
pretty nice and um i'm not saying anyone

617
00:25:00,390 --> 00:24:58,640
has to do that but i mean um i mean i

618
00:25:02,310 --> 00:25:00,400
put my name there

619
00:25:04,470 --> 00:25:02,320
yes thank you thank you for your

620
00:25:07,830 --> 00:25:04,480
contribution martin thank you

621
00:25:09,909 --> 00:25:07,840
yeah that my pleasure and um i'm really

622
00:25:12,390 --> 00:25:09,919
excited about this now during

623
00:25:14,630 --> 00:25:12,400
that particular day that evening i do

624
00:25:16,149 --> 00:25:14,640
have a show and i'm wondering if there's

625
00:25:17,269 --> 00:25:16,159
uh and i'm actually going to be out

626
00:25:18,950 --> 00:25:17,279
where you are i'm going to be on the

627
00:25:20,149 --> 00:25:18,960
west coast you're going to be back here

628
00:25:21,909 --> 00:25:20,159
but um

629
00:25:24,310 --> 00:25:21,919
i'm going to try to see if i can get any

630
00:25:25,350 --> 00:25:24,320
type of uh feedback

631
00:25:26,470 --> 00:25:25,360
i don't know if you'll be able to

632
00:25:28,230 --> 00:25:26,480
commute you probably won't be able to

633
00:25:29,990 --> 00:25:28,240
communicate at all but it's still i'd

634
00:25:32,710 --> 00:25:30,000
like to check into what's going on that

635
00:25:35,029 --> 00:25:32,720
day can anyone see this live stream

636
00:25:36,390 --> 00:25:35,039
during the day

637
00:25:38,470 --> 00:25:36,400
well uh

638
00:25:40,630 --> 00:25:38,480
i don't know the exact arrangements i'm

639
00:25:43,909 --> 00:25:40,640
assured by the national press club that

640
00:25:46,310 --> 00:25:43,919
it it will be done live stream uh it may

641
00:25:48,710 --> 00:25:46,320
go through my youtube channel

642
00:25:50,470 --> 00:25:48,720
i do have a youtube channel so it may be

643
00:25:52,710 --> 00:25:50,480
uh

644
00:25:55,029 --> 00:25:52,720
processed through there i'm not certain

645
00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:55,039
about that yet but i will uh i will

646
00:25:58,630 --> 00:25:57,440
inform the public i will inform everyone

647
00:26:04,470 --> 00:25:58,640
uh

648
00:26:05,510 --> 00:26:04,480
that live stream

649
00:26:08,870 --> 00:26:05,520
um

650
00:26:11,990 --> 00:26:08,880
i will be sending out a press release uh

651
00:26:14,870 --> 00:26:12,000
i think october the 7th

652
00:26:16,789 --> 00:26:14,880
uh and that'll identify the four

653
00:26:18,870 --> 00:26:16,799
individuals that will be involved in

654
00:26:21,110 --> 00:26:18,880
this and

655
00:26:21,990 --> 00:26:21,120
provide more information on

656
00:26:25,269 --> 00:26:22,000
on

657
00:26:28,630 --> 00:26:25,279
where and when and how it'll take place

658
00:26:32,230 --> 00:26:28,640
excellent uh before you go i i have one

659
00:26:34,789 --> 00:26:32,240
last question for you and it's a it's a

660
00:26:36,230 --> 00:26:34,799
speculation and some people don't like

661
00:26:40,230 --> 00:26:36,240
to speculate but

662
00:26:43,190 --> 00:26:40,240
i'm gonna ask you what do you think

663
00:26:47,110 --> 00:26:43,200
the whole thing was about

664
00:26:49,510 --> 00:26:47,120
when that happened in 1967

665
00:26:51,350 --> 00:26:49,520
well this is speculation but

666
00:26:53,590 --> 00:26:51,360
because

667
00:26:57,110 --> 00:26:53,600
this has happened so many places in so

668
00:26:57,909 --> 00:26:57,120
many uh locations of the world uh i i

669
00:27:00,149 --> 00:26:57,919
could

670
00:27:02,789 --> 00:27:00,159
name at least ten

671
00:27:05,590 --> 00:27:02,799
uh where ufos have come over simply uh

672
00:27:08,789 --> 00:27:05,600
showing a beam of light on uh on the

673
00:27:10,230 --> 00:27:08,799
nuclear weapons or nuclear storage areas

674
00:27:11,110 --> 00:27:10,240
or

675
00:27:13,669 --> 00:27:11,120
uh

676
00:27:15,110 --> 00:27:13,679
interfered with them like such in my

677
00:27:17,830 --> 00:27:15,120
case

678
00:27:20,149 --> 00:27:17,840
where no damage was done it was simply a

679
00:27:21,750 --> 00:27:20,159
show uh was

680
00:27:24,389 --> 00:27:21,760
i think i think they're trying to send

681
00:27:28,070 --> 00:27:24,399
us a message very simply

682
00:27:31,350 --> 00:27:28,080
uh get rid of your nuclear weapons and

683
00:27:33,029 --> 00:27:31,360
i think that's the message and

684
00:27:35,830 --> 00:27:33,039
i don't know if you heard the

685
00:27:39,350 --> 00:27:35,840
latest report that

686
00:27:42,630 --> 00:27:39,360
i think is general milly who had to

687
00:27:45,430 --> 00:27:42,640
kind of adjust things because we had uh

688
00:27:49,190 --> 00:27:45,440
president trump was out of control or at

689
00:27:52,070 --> 00:27:49,200
least he felt he was and i might take

690
00:27:54,549 --> 00:27:52,080
some action with regard to nukes

691
00:27:56,549 --> 00:27:54,559
but not only that there's um

692
00:28:00,149 --> 00:27:56,559
a war going on now between india and

693
00:28:02,549 --> 00:28:00,159
pakistan they're both nuclear powers

694
00:28:04,310 --> 00:28:02,559
we also have the taliban that just

695
00:28:07,350 --> 00:28:04,320
took over afghanistan which has

696
00:28:10,789 --> 00:28:07,360
relationships with uh pakistan

697
00:28:13,350 --> 00:28:10,799
uh and who's to know who's to

698
00:28:17,110 --> 00:28:13,360
yeah what what would happen if uh the

699
00:28:19,350 --> 00:28:17,120
taliban got a hold of nukes somehow

700
00:28:21,269 --> 00:28:19,360
so we still live in a very dangerous

701
00:28:23,350 --> 00:28:21,279
world with regard to nuclear war i think

702
00:28:25,590 --> 00:28:23,360
people underestimate the dangers of

703
00:28:28,630 --> 00:28:25,600
nuclear war and uh

704
00:28:31,430 --> 00:28:28,640
and so i think uh the message from e.t

705
00:28:33,190 --> 00:28:31,440
if that's what it was uh is is well

706
00:28:35,990 --> 00:28:33,200
taken we ought to

707
00:28:38,549 --> 00:28:36,000
work hard now to try to

708
00:28:40,549 --> 00:28:38,559
uh reduce the world stockpiles of

709
00:28:41,510 --> 00:28:40,559
nuclear weapons and uh

710
00:28:43,669 --> 00:28:41,520
and

711
00:28:45,669 --> 00:28:43,679
have our own goal of trying to abolish

712
00:28:48,230 --> 00:28:45,679
them completely

713
00:28:50,310 --> 00:28:48,240
yeah that would you know it's it's the

714
00:28:52,789 --> 00:28:50,320
old saying you can't unring a bell you

715
00:28:54,470 --> 00:28:52,799
know i mean it would be awful

716
00:28:57,110 --> 00:28:54,480
hard to

717
00:28:59,190 --> 00:28:57,120
get commitments to actually

718
00:29:00,149 --> 00:28:59,200
eliminate them but you know it's it's

719
00:29:02,149 --> 00:29:00,159
really

720
00:29:04,549 --> 00:29:02,159
uh we're in that bottleneck of

721
00:29:05,990 --> 00:29:04,559
technology where we could easily in

722
00:29:08,470 --> 00:29:06,000
several different ways

723
00:29:12,950 --> 00:29:08,480
um be removed from the planet you know

724
00:29:15,269 --> 00:29:12,960
by ourselves so um yeah um

725
00:29:16,950 --> 00:29:15,279
i'm i'm surprised that

726
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:16,960
one just one more thing but i'm also

727
00:29:18,870 --> 00:29:18,000
surprised

728
00:29:21,990 --> 00:29:18,880
that

729
00:29:23,750 --> 00:29:22,000
like for instance the uap task force

730
00:29:26,389 --> 00:29:23,760
this whole thing with

731
00:29:28,630 --> 00:29:26,399
the nukes i'm wondering i mean that's

732
00:29:30,149 --> 00:29:28,640
very important i think you know yes

733
00:29:31,990 --> 00:29:30,159
these happened a long time you know

734
00:29:34,070 --> 00:29:32,000
these things happened a long time ago do

735
00:29:37,110 --> 00:29:34,080
you happen to know when the latest

736
00:29:37,830 --> 00:29:37,120
event was where there was a ufo involved

737
00:29:41,350 --> 00:29:37,840
in

738
00:29:42,389 --> 00:29:41,360
any type of over nuclear uh

739
00:29:43,909 --> 00:29:42,399
well

740
00:29:45,750 --> 00:29:43,919
uh

741
00:29:48,310 --> 00:29:45,760
there i think there have been recent

742
00:29:52,710 --> 00:29:48,320
events uh but those

743
00:29:57,430 --> 00:29:52,720
details are yet to develop i heard

744
00:29:58,710 --> 00:29:57,440
recently that as late as 2018 there was

745
00:30:02,149 --> 00:29:58,720
an incident

746
00:30:03,590 --> 00:30:02,159
at one of the bases uh uh in regarding

747
00:30:07,510 --> 00:30:03,600
uh

748
00:30:09,510 --> 00:30:07,520
so

749
00:30:11,110 --> 00:30:09,520
but again that

750
00:30:13,430 --> 00:30:11,120
that sort of thing would require

751
00:30:16,070 --> 00:30:13,440
witnesses to come forward that uh right

752
00:30:16,950 --> 00:30:16,080
now do not want to talk about it

753
00:30:19,750 --> 00:30:16,960
um

754
00:30:22,950 --> 00:30:19,760
but if we have these open hearings

755
00:30:24,950 --> 00:30:22,960
more people come will come forward and

756
00:30:27,110 --> 00:30:24,960
and then

757
00:30:29,110 --> 00:30:27,120
congress will find out about other

758
00:30:31,830 --> 00:30:29,120
witnesses that could

759
00:30:32,710 --> 00:30:31,840
could be asked to come forward

760
00:30:34,950 --> 00:30:32,720
right

761
00:30:38,070 --> 00:30:34,960
uh robert it's always

762
00:30:40,549 --> 00:30:38,080
a pleasure to talk to you always and uh

763
00:30:43,029 --> 00:30:40,559
thank you so much for your efforts and

764
00:30:45,990 --> 00:30:43,039
uh for those of you who are considering

765
00:30:48,389 --> 00:30:46,000
uh helping this event happen uh the link

766
00:30:51,190 --> 00:30:48,399
is down in the show notes and i will

767
00:30:53,190 --> 00:30:51,200
also follow up on uh how you can watch

768
00:30:56,070 --> 00:30:53,200
this thing live as soon as i hear back

769
00:30:57,590 --> 00:30:56,080
from from robert thank you so much thank

770
00:31:00,549 --> 00:30:57,600
you for giving me this opportunity

771
00:31:01,830 --> 00:31:00,559
martin and uh and good luck to you and

772
00:31:02,870 --> 00:31:01,840
um

773
00:31:05,190 --> 00:31:02,880
i'll

774
00:31:07,269 --> 00:31:05,200
try to keep you informed uh and and

775
00:31:08,149 --> 00:31:07,279
everyone informed on as things go

776
00:31:08,950 --> 00:31:08,159
forward

777
00:31:11,190 --> 00:31:08,960
thanks

778
00:31:12,070 --> 00:31:11,200
excellent all right take care

779
00:31:15,190 --> 00:31:12,080
you too

780
00:31:16,470 --> 00:31:15,200
all right so our next guest is uh let me

781
00:31:19,029 --> 00:31:16,480
put this up

782
00:31:21,430 --> 00:31:19,039
we have uh martin keller

783
00:31:22,630 --> 00:31:21,440
and uh he is a former pop culture

784
00:31:25,509 --> 00:31:22,640
journalist

785
00:31:27,350 --> 00:31:25,519
and he has written um a book that we're

786
00:31:29,830 --> 00:31:27,360
going to be talking about

787
00:31:31,669 --> 00:31:29,840
tonight and i i was wondering what this

788
00:31:33,029 --> 00:31:31,679
pen club thing was about

789
00:31:34,710 --> 00:31:33,039
i started reading a little bit about it

790
00:31:37,909 --> 00:31:34,720
but i'm going to bring him in

791
00:31:40,789 --> 00:31:37,919
right now and uh we are

792
00:31:43,750 --> 00:31:40,799
going to discuss what his

793
00:31:48,389 --> 00:31:43,760
book is about welcome to the show martin

794
00:31:51,350 --> 00:31:49,430
okay

795
00:31:53,350 --> 00:31:51,360
there you go welcome to the show it's

796
00:31:54,870 --> 00:31:53,360
martin and martin i think i've done this

797
00:31:56,870 --> 00:31:54,880
one other time

798
00:31:59,669 --> 00:31:56,880
guys you can call me marty if you want

799
00:32:02,070 --> 00:31:59,679
to avoid confusion for uh listeners

800
00:32:04,230 --> 00:32:02,080
yeah that's my childhood my childhood

801
00:32:06,389 --> 00:32:04,240
name people still call me that but

802
00:32:09,590 --> 00:32:06,399
anyway welcome to the show thank you for

803
00:32:13,110 --> 00:32:09,600
uh happy to be here yeah so you you had

804
00:32:15,190 --> 00:32:13,120
uh quite an interesting career in uh and

805
00:32:18,549 --> 00:32:15,200
pop culture journalism

806
00:32:21,590 --> 00:32:18,559
and uh could you give the listener your

807
00:32:24,630 --> 00:32:21,600
background and also i want to find out

808
00:32:26,149 --> 00:32:24,640
how you got interested in this topic

809
00:32:28,070 --> 00:32:26,159
well that's

810
00:32:31,269 --> 00:32:28,080
a lively discussion that's covered

811
00:32:34,149 --> 00:32:31,279
pretty extensively in the book i uh

812
00:32:36,789 --> 00:32:34,159
covered pop culture for about uh

813
00:32:38,870 --> 00:32:36,799
15 or so years

814
00:32:42,389 --> 00:32:38,880
here in the twin cities

815
00:32:45,029 --> 00:32:42,399
uh from the late 70s to the early 90s i

816
00:32:47,110 --> 00:32:45,039
still occasionally write a piece about

817
00:32:50,630 --> 00:32:47,120
something in pop culture

818
00:32:53,269 --> 00:32:50,640
or individuals or artists etc

819
00:32:55,990 --> 00:32:53,279
and then i got tired of of the subject i

820
00:32:58,389 --> 00:32:56,000
moved into public relations

821
00:33:00,470 --> 00:32:58,399
i worked at one agency for two years we

822
00:33:03,509 --> 00:33:00,480
had clients like federal express

823
00:33:05,590 --> 00:33:03,519
metropolitan sports commission etc some

824
00:33:07,509 --> 00:33:05,600
fairly high profile stuff i learned a

825
00:33:11,029 --> 00:33:07,519
bunch of new tricks

826
00:33:12,230 --> 00:33:11,039
and i eventually went out on my own as a

827
00:33:14,710 --> 00:33:12,240
freelance

828
00:33:17,750 --> 00:33:14,720
publicist and then established a

829
00:33:18,950 --> 00:33:17,760
consulting pr consultancy called media

830
00:33:21,110 --> 00:33:18,960
savant

831
00:33:23,190 --> 00:33:21,120
communications but i've been interested

832
00:33:24,789 --> 00:33:23,200
in in space

833
00:33:27,350 --> 00:33:24,799
since i was a kid

834
00:33:29,590 --> 00:33:27,360
you know i used to make my mother get up

835
00:33:31,430 --> 00:33:29,600
with me at 4 30 in the morning to watch

836
00:33:33,830 --> 00:33:31,440
the early launches of the mercury and

837
00:33:37,029 --> 00:33:33,840
gemini programs and later

838
00:33:39,350 --> 00:33:37,039
apollo and you know concurrently i also

839
00:33:41,190 --> 00:33:39,360
became interested in ufos because guess

840
00:33:42,870 --> 00:33:41,200
what ufos

841
00:33:45,350 --> 00:33:42,880
are in space

842
00:33:47,509 --> 00:33:45,360
and there were reports that they were

843
00:33:49,750 --> 00:33:47,519
there were site astronauts were having

844
00:33:52,549 --> 00:33:49,760
sightings you know i was such a space

845
00:33:54,470 --> 00:33:52,559
geek then that i wrote to nasa

846
00:33:56,470 --> 00:33:54,480
and asked them for more information and

847
00:33:59,350 --> 00:33:56,480
they sent me uh

848
00:34:02,070 --> 00:33:59,360
reams of documents public documents

849
00:34:04,950 --> 00:34:02,080
about each program and also autographed

850
00:34:06,870 --> 00:34:04,960
pictures of astronauts so

851
00:34:09,190 --> 00:34:06,880
i was really into it i even wrote to

852
00:34:11,510 --> 00:34:09,200
john glenn after his uh three orbits

853
00:34:12,550 --> 00:34:11,520
around the earth i got a

854
00:34:14,629 --> 00:34:12,560
i got a

855
00:34:16,629 --> 00:34:14,639
letter from his office and then a signed

856
00:34:19,589 --> 00:34:16,639
photograph from him

857
00:34:22,069 --> 00:34:19,599
turns out according to senator

858
00:34:23,990 --> 00:34:22,079
harry reid from nevada that john glenn

859
00:34:25,750 --> 00:34:24,000
has been interested in the subject for a

860
00:34:27,669 --> 00:34:25,760
long time and

861
00:34:29,349 --> 00:34:27,679
that was reported in the new york times

862
00:34:31,829 --> 00:34:29,359
a couple of years ago when all this

863
00:34:33,510 --> 00:34:31,839
public information came out but you know

864
00:34:36,550 --> 00:34:33,520
i also had some

865
00:34:38,069 --> 00:34:36,560
sightings in high school as a kid

866
00:34:41,430 --> 00:34:38,079
and then later

867
00:34:44,149 --> 00:34:41,440
in the early 90s after i i had you know

868
00:34:46,069 --> 00:34:44,159
a dry spell of not really

869
00:34:48,470 --> 00:34:46,079
paying attention to the whole ufo

870
00:34:49,829 --> 00:34:48,480
discussion or anything transpiring in

871
00:34:51,430 --> 00:34:49,839
ufology

872
00:34:54,149 --> 00:34:51,440
i had a bunch of strange high

873
00:34:55,909 --> 00:34:54,159
strangeness events in my home

874
00:34:57,589 --> 00:34:55,919
that

875
00:35:01,109 --> 00:34:57,599
really opened

876
00:35:02,470 --> 00:35:01,119
the whole realm to me again and

877
00:35:06,069 --> 00:35:02,480
subsequently

878
00:35:10,470 --> 00:35:06,079
took a a freelance offer to

879
00:35:13,829 --> 00:35:10,480
um profile dr steven greer at seasetti

880
00:35:16,870 --> 00:35:13,839
um but you know this was six months into

881
00:35:17,829 --> 00:35:16,880
a period in my life in south minneapolis

882
00:35:19,510 --> 00:35:17,839
where

883
00:35:21,510 --> 00:35:19,520
i was

884
00:35:23,870 --> 00:35:21,520
having some really strange dreams there

885
00:35:25,510 --> 00:35:23,880
were lights on in the house

886
00:35:28,470 --> 00:35:25,520
consecutively

887
00:35:30,950 --> 00:35:28,480
that my wife and i could not discern you

888
00:35:33,109 --> 00:35:30,960
know why this was happening and

889
00:35:34,390 --> 00:35:33,119
there was one particular precognitive

890
00:35:36,550 --> 00:35:34,400
dream that

891
00:35:39,910 --> 00:35:36,560
in may of that year

892
00:35:41,829 --> 00:35:39,920
that was realized in boston in july and

893
00:35:43,670 --> 00:35:41,839
that kind of blew my mind and that's

894
00:35:45,270 --> 00:35:43,680
deal detailed pretty heavily in the

895
00:35:47,030 --> 00:35:45,280
first chapter so

896
00:35:51,430 --> 00:35:47,040
there's kind of a long answer to your

897
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:55,349
and now i think you're on on mute

898
00:35:59,910 --> 00:35:56,829
yes i

899
00:36:01,510 --> 00:35:59,920
was i and there was a little this little

900
00:36:03,750 --> 00:36:01,520
background noise here so i have to mute

901
00:36:06,390 --> 00:36:03,760
every now and then uh in my studio

902
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:06,400
outside of my studio so

903
00:36:12,870 --> 00:36:09,440
yeah um i like long answers by the way

904
00:36:14,550 --> 00:36:12,880
um and no it's it's interesting i always

905
00:36:15,430 --> 00:36:14,560
you know there's always a story why

906
00:36:17,430 --> 00:36:15,440
someone

907
00:36:19,670 --> 00:36:17,440
gets interested in the topic can you

908
00:36:22,470 --> 00:36:19,680
describe you do you think you actually

909
00:36:24,950 --> 00:36:22,480
saw a ufo or was it

910
00:36:28,069 --> 00:36:24,960
something else

911
00:36:30,550 --> 00:36:28,079
well in high school uh

912
00:36:32,069 --> 00:36:30,560
some high school friends and i saw a

913
00:36:35,750 --> 00:36:32,079
white

914
00:36:37,190 --> 00:36:35,760
object oval shaped about 30 feet in

915
00:36:39,109 --> 00:36:37,200
diameter

916
00:36:40,870 --> 00:36:39,119
hovering out over the edge of town by

917
00:36:42,790 --> 00:36:40,880
our high school

918
00:36:44,710 --> 00:36:42,800
one very cold night in western north

919
00:36:46,950 --> 00:36:44,720
dakota where i grew up

920
00:36:49,670 --> 00:36:46,960
the same week in which there had been

921
00:36:52,230 --> 00:36:49,680
numerous sightings of ufos

922
00:36:54,069 --> 00:36:52,240
across the western part of the state in

923
00:36:57,670 --> 00:36:54,079
the mainstream media at that time you

924
00:37:00,310 --> 00:36:57,680
know radio television newspaper

925
00:37:01,190 --> 00:37:00,320
but uh that was that was witness with

926
00:37:02,150 --> 00:37:01,200
three

927
00:37:04,069 --> 00:37:02,160
um

928
00:37:06,069 --> 00:37:04,079
other friends of mine including my best

929
00:37:07,190 --> 00:37:06,079
friend who i've known since fifth grade

930
00:37:08,870 --> 00:37:07,200
he's

931
00:37:11,109 --> 00:37:08,880
still a pretty

932
00:37:13,190 --> 00:37:11,119
good friend of mine he's my attorney in

933
00:37:16,069 --> 00:37:13,200
fact we used to debate together in high

934
00:37:19,990 --> 00:37:18,069
prior to that sighting we had another

935
00:37:21,589 --> 00:37:20,000
sighting in the park

936
00:37:24,710 --> 00:37:21,599
while we were walking to a student

937
00:37:25,990 --> 00:37:24,720
council meeting one night that same week

938
00:37:28,870 --> 00:37:26,000
where a

939
00:37:31,109 --> 00:37:28,880
small red orb about that size about the

940
00:37:33,430 --> 00:37:31,119
size of a ping-pong ball came down from

941
00:37:35,990 --> 00:37:33,440
the top of the butte

942
00:37:38,630 --> 00:37:36,000
uh that was behind his parents house it

943
00:37:40,710 --> 00:37:38,640
was a it was a city park

944
00:37:43,510 --> 00:37:40,720
and it hovered in front of us at about

945
00:37:45,270 --> 00:37:43,520
10 feet and

946
00:37:47,829 --> 00:37:45,280
didn't make any noise

947
00:37:51,349 --> 00:37:47,839
scared the hell out i i can't say it

948
00:37:53,430 --> 00:37:51,359
scared the hell out of us but it uh it

949
00:37:54,230 --> 00:37:53,440
really baffled us we didn't know what it

950
00:37:56,390 --> 00:37:54,240
was

951
00:37:57,910 --> 00:37:56,400
uh we didn't have much conversation

952
00:38:00,950 --> 00:37:57,920
about it other than

953
00:38:02,150 --> 00:38:00,960
my friend jim uh saying what the hell is

954
00:38:04,390 --> 00:38:02,160
this and

955
00:38:06,310 --> 00:38:04,400
i replied being a good kid you know we

956
00:38:08,230 --> 00:38:06,320
were good catholic boys

957
00:38:09,430 --> 00:38:08,240
i replied it's the devil because it's

958
00:38:12,310 --> 00:38:09,440
red

959
00:38:14,950 --> 00:38:12,320
and it's and it's weird and

960
00:38:16,790 --> 00:38:14,960
it seems supernatural uh you know to

961
00:38:20,470 --> 00:38:16,800
this day i still don't know what it is

962
00:38:23,589 --> 00:38:20,480
but i'll tell you uh in the early 90s

963
00:38:26,030 --> 00:38:23,599
during these periods of high strangeness

964
00:38:29,190 --> 00:38:26,040
in the fall of that of that year

965
00:38:31,349 --> 00:38:29,200
1992 i believe

966
00:38:33,750 --> 00:38:31,359
five little red orbs showed up in my

967
00:38:35,829 --> 00:38:33,760
bedroom at 403 in the morning and i and

968
00:38:37,270 --> 00:38:35,839
i know it was 403 because i looked at

969
00:38:39,510 --> 00:38:37,280
the clock twice

970
00:38:42,069 --> 00:38:39,520
to make sure i wasn't

971
00:38:43,109 --> 00:38:42,079
wasn't dreaming this up and there were

972
00:38:45,030 --> 00:38:43,119
some

973
00:38:47,190 --> 00:38:45,040
fairly disturbing

974
00:38:49,990 --> 00:38:47,200
residual side effects from

975
00:38:52,150 --> 00:38:50,000
from that incident and one of the

976
00:38:54,630 --> 00:38:52,160
you know threads in the book is trying

977
00:38:56,550 --> 00:38:54,640
to unravel what what the hell are these

978
00:38:59,589 --> 00:38:56,560
are these extraterrestrial are these

979
00:39:01,670 --> 00:38:59,599
some sort of spiritual manifestations

980
00:39:04,069 --> 00:39:01,680
or are they just you know some something

981
00:39:06,150 --> 00:39:04,079
completely unknown that that we're not

982
00:39:08,470 --> 00:39:06,160
aware of yet so

983
00:39:10,870 --> 00:39:08,480
uh those were my early

984
00:39:13,589 --> 00:39:10,880
sightings and my personal high

985
00:39:15,349 --> 00:39:13,599
strangeness experiences that that i

986
00:39:17,510 --> 00:39:15,359
detail pretty thoroughly in the first

987
00:39:20,150 --> 00:39:17,520
two chapters of the book

988
00:39:21,990 --> 00:39:20,160
you know uh i've heard a number of times

989
00:39:25,430 --> 00:39:22,000
what people will talk

990
00:39:26,550 --> 00:39:25,440
about well first having ufo sighting

991
00:39:28,870 --> 00:39:26,560
and then

992
00:39:31,829 --> 00:39:28,880
orbs in the house i i think i've heard

993
00:39:33,109 --> 00:39:31,839
that 10 times over the years

994
00:39:36,230 --> 00:39:33,119
and and

995
00:39:38,230 --> 00:39:36,240
and by the way just uh for the listener

996
00:39:40,630 --> 00:39:38,240
we're coming up in just a couple months

997
00:39:42,950 --> 00:39:40,640
on 10 years of doing this show which is

998
00:39:45,030 --> 00:39:42,960
pretty amazing i'm still enthralled with

999
00:39:47,670 --> 00:39:45,040
doing it i still really enjoy doing it

1000
00:39:48,550 --> 00:39:47,680
let me ask you this first object you

1001
00:39:50,230 --> 00:39:48,560
mentioned

1002
00:39:51,750 --> 00:39:50,240
i'm going to show you something up on

1003
00:39:53,670 --> 00:39:51,760
the screen and for the person that's

1004
00:39:55,430 --> 00:39:53,680
only listening to audio it's a the

1005
00:39:58,150 --> 00:39:55,440
soccoro incident

1006
00:39:59,589 --> 00:39:58,160
uh shape did it have a shape similar to

1007
00:40:01,910 --> 00:39:59,599
this

1008
00:40:03,589 --> 00:40:01,920
i think it did although my friend jim

1009
00:40:06,950 --> 00:40:03,599
says that he couldn't make out any

1010
00:40:09,190 --> 00:40:06,960
structural elements but you know it was

1011
00:40:11,510 --> 00:40:09,200
it was night it was about 20 below and

1012
00:40:13,349 --> 00:40:11,520
we were outside there outside the school

1013
00:40:14,870 --> 00:40:13,359
high school building without our coats

1014
00:40:16,470 --> 00:40:14,880
on

1015
00:40:18,870 --> 00:40:16,480
we've been attending a high school

1016
00:40:21,430 --> 00:40:18,880
varsity basketball game

1017
00:40:24,390 --> 00:40:21,440
and uh i think one of our four

1018
00:40:26,790 --> 00:40:24,400
friends that witnessed this

1019
00:40:28,790 --> 00:40:26,800
said hey let's get in in my car and go

1020
00:40:30,950 --> 00:40:28,800
see it and i'm the guy that pooh-poohed

1021
00:40:32,950 --> 00:40:30,960
and i said nah you know it's

1022
00:40:34,630 --> 00:40:32,960
we don't have our coats it's 20 below

1023
00:40:37,109 --> 00:40:34,640
there's a good game that's about to

1024
00:40:39,430 --> 00:40:37,119
resume but you know if i if i had that

1025
00:40:41,030 --> 00:40:39,440
moment to do over we we would have gone

1026
00:40:43,589 --> 00:40:41,040
out there was only about a quarter of a

1027
00:40:46,150 --> 00:40:43,599
mile away from us

1028
00:40:48,390 --> 00:40:46,160
wow interesting well and you know it

1029
00:40:50,710 --> 00:40:48,400
sounds to me like uh you know some

1030
00:40:52,470 --> 00:40:50,720
people just move on but it sounds to me

1031
00:40:53,589 --> 00:40:52,480
like this impacted your life and then

1032
00:40:55,190 --> 00:40:53,599
later on

1033
00:40:57,750 --> 00:40:55,200
you know those things coming in your

1034
00:41:00,710 --> 00:40:57,760
room uh that's

1035
00:41:03,990 --> 00:41:00,720
that would scare the heck out of me

1036
00:41:04,790 --> 00:41:04,000
and and uh you mentioned the possible

1037
00:41:07,990 --> 00:41:04,800
like

1038
00:41:09,829 --> 00:41:08,000
uh the devil or or something you know

1039
00:41:11,910 --> 00:41:09,839
satanic or whatever

1040
00:41:13,510 --> 00:41:11,920
that's that's not on you probably know

1041
00:41:15,589 --> 00:41:13,520
this but that's not an uncommon

1042
00:41:17,750 --> 00:41:15,599
statement too for people trying to

1043
00:41:19,750 --> 00:41:17,760
explain these type of things

1044
00:41:21,910 --> 00:41:19,760
yeah but i also think it's a it's kind

1045
00:41:24,230 --> 00:41:21,920
of a knee-jerk reaction especially if

1046
00:41:25,910 --> 00:41:24,240
you have any sort of religious

1047
00:41:27,990 --> 00:41:25,920
grounding and i know at that point i'd

1048
00:41:29,510 --> 00:41:28,000
been in catholic schools my whole life

1049
00:41:31,990 --> 00:41:29,520
in fact they even went to a catholic

1050
00:41:32,829 --> 00:41:32,000
university subsequently

1051
00:41:35,589 --> 00:41:32,839
but

1052
00:41:38,069 --> 00:41:35,599
um um

1053
00:41:39,750 --> 00:41:38,079
i can't say

1054
00:41:43,349 --> 00:41:39,760
you know that's a discussion that needs

1055
00:41:45,270 --> 00:41:43,359
to be held i think as an ongoing

1056
00:41:47,750 --> 00:41:45,280
topic of interest

1057
00:41:50,470 --> 00:41:47,760
because you know throughout my little

1058
00:41:52,069 --> 00:41:50,480
adventures in the ufo community during

1059
00:41:53,670 --> 00:41:52,079
the 90s i would

1060
00:41:57,109 --> 00:41:53,680
occasionally run

1061
00:41:59,589 --> 00:41:57,119
these stories these sightings of these

1062
00:42:01,829 --> 00:41:59,599
little red objects by people

1063
00:42:04,309 --> 00:42:01,839
who were researchers and and knew more

1064
00:42:06,630 --> 00:42:04,319
about the subject than i did

1065
00:42:09,270 --> 00:42:06,640
and invariably they would all say it's

1066
00:42:11,510 --> 00:42:09,280
e.t but you know i always thought well

1067
00:42:13,589 --> 00:42:11,520
how do you know for sure

1068
00:42:15,990 --> 00:42:13,599
where's the man where's the handbook you

1069
00:42:18,390 --> 00:42:16,000
know show me the manual that that

1070
00:42:21,670 --> 00:42:18,400
verifies that statement

1071
00:42:23,829 --> 00:42:21,680
that's right that's right um the space

1072
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:23,839
pen club the name of your book first of

1073
00:42:26,870 --> 00:42:24,880
all

1074
00:42:28,390 --> 00:42:26,880
i always think of space pen as the one

1075
00:42:30,390 --> 00:42:28,400
that can write upside down and

1076
00:42:31,430 --> 00:42:30,400
everything else is that what a space pen

1077
00:42:38,710 --> 00:42:31,440
is

1078
00:42:40,710 --> 00:42:38,720
out in nevada

1079
00:42:43,270 --> 00:42:40,720
excuse me it's been around for about 60

1080
00:42:45,990 --> 00:42:43,280
some years it was invented by paul

1081
00:42:51,270 --> 00:42:49,430
during my sophomore year at college one

1082
00:42:53,030 --> 00:42:51,280
of my friends who worked in the college

1083
00:42:55,030 --> 00:42:53,040
bookstore

1084
00:42:57,349 --> 00:42:55,040
found this pen

1085
00:42:59,270 --> 00:42:57,359
the first pen to write in space i mean

1086
00:43:00,870 --> 00:42:59,280
that's the that was kind of the branding

1087
00:43:03,109 --> 00:43:00,880
they had around it

1088
00:43:06,309 --> 00:43:03,119
and uh sorry my dog is barking

1089
00:43:09,510 --> 00:43:07,910
he brought it back to the dorms and

1090
00:43:12,790 --> 00:43:09,520
everyone thought well this is pretty

1091
00:43:15,349 --> 00:43:12,800
weird this is pretty cool and at first

1092
00:43:17,589 --> 00:43:15,359
it was kind of a joke among uh among a

1093
00:43:18,710 --> 00:43:17,599
small group of friends and then

1094
00:43:21,349 --> 00:43:18,720
it later

1095
00:43:24,870 --> 00:43:21,359
you know as things developed uh it

1096
00:43:28,069 --> 00:43:24,880
became this symbolic icon and

1097
00:43:29,589 --> 00:43:28,079
and to me it it ultimately represented

1098
00:43:32,550 --> 00:43:29,599
self-exploration

1099
00:43:34,950 --> 00:43:32,560
cosmic consciousness and communication

1100
00:43:38,069 --> 00:43:34,960
transcendence and the occasional quest

1101
00:43:40,630 --> 00:43:38,079
for beer girls tunes and controlled

1102
00:43:43,670 --> 00:43:40,640
substances i mean come on this was these

1103
00:43:45,270 --> 00:43:43,680
were our college years back in the 70s

1104
00:43:47,349 --> 00:43:45,280
uh but the guy

1105
00:43:49,910 --> 00:43:47,359
the guy that uh

1106
00:43:52,390 --> 00:43:49,920
discovered the pen and and we call him

1107
00:43:55,829 --> 00:43:52,400
our accidental founder

1108
00:43:58,150 --> 00:43:55,839
we built uh we built different uh events

1109
00:44:00,550 --> 00:43:58,160
around the space pen

1110
00:44:04,150 --> 00:44:00,560
and it was always sort of an odd

1111
00:44:06,230 --> 00:44:04,160
ad hoc organization the space bank club

1112
00:44:09,270 --> 00:44:06,240
uh we'd have spring rights and peak with

1113
00:44:11,109 --> 00:44:09,280
the leaves and then but you know our

1114
00:44:12,470 --> 00:44:11,119
founder denny

1115
00:44:14,390 --> 00:44:12,480
lynch

1116
00:44:16,790 --> 00:44:14,400
really said that the space pen

1117
00:44:19,910 --> 00:44:16,800
represented possibilities

1118
00:44:22,230 --> 00:44:19,920
and i think the whole ufo discussion

1119
00:44:23,990 --> 00:44:22,240
represents possibilities what are the

1120
00:44:26,550 --> 00:44:24,000
possibilities if we had a true

1121
00:44:27,829 --> 00:44:26,560
disclosure event worldwide

1122
00:44:29,990 --> 00:44:27,839
if we had

1123
00:44:32,150 --> 00:44:30,000
established relationships with whatever

1124
00:44:34,870 --> 00:44:32,160
these machines and or

1125
00:44:37,670 --> 00:44:34,880
visitors are doing here i mean the

1126
00:44:39,030 --> 00:44:37,680
possibility it's blue sky and and the

1127
00:44:41,589 --> 00:44:39,040
space pen

1128
00:44:43,349 --> 00:44:41,599
club has come to represent

1129
00:44:45,109 --> 00:44:43,359
um

1130
00:44:47,990 --> 00:44:45,119
at least in my thinking anyone that

1131
00:44:50,390 --> 00:44:48,000
seeks you know interaction with a with

1132
00:44:53,030 --> 00:44:50,400
another consciousness another you know

1133
00:44:55,589 --> 00:44:53,040
other beings other um

1134
00:44:57,829 --> 00:44:55,599
situations like this that are you know

1135
00:45:00,470 --> 00:44:57,839
outside the box of of everyday

1136
00:45:02,390 --> 00:45:00,480
experience so the club is actually still

1137
00:45:04,550 --> 00:45:02,400
around the uh

1138
00:45:06,710 --> 00:45:04,560
the core group of the space pen club

1139
00:45:08,790 --> 00:45:06,720
still meets over zoom

1140
00:45:10,870 --> 00:45:08,800
they get together a couple time years a

1141
00:45:12,390 --> 00:45:10,880
couple times a year to golf and fish and

1142
00:45:14,550 --> 00:45:12,400
stuff like that i

1143
00:45:17,349 --> 00:45:14,560
i've never been that uh

1144
00:45:19,990 --> 00:45:17,359
that ardent of a member i suppose i

1145
00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:20,000
haven't paid my dues or something but

1146
00:45:25,270 --> 00:45:23,280
um they're still around and uh they were

1147
00:45:27,190 --> 00:45:25,280
obviously all pretty

1148
00:45:29,430 --> 00:45:27,200
fascinated i would write a book called

1149
00:45:31,510 --> 00:45:29,440
the space pen club the subtitle we

1150
00:45:34,870 --> 00:45:31,520
should point out martin is

1151
00:45:37,349 --> 00:45:34,880
is uh close encounters of the fifth kind

1152
00:45:40,950 --> 00:45:37,359
ufo disclosure

1153
00:45:43,109 --> 00:45:40,960
consciousness and other mind zoomers so

1154
00:45:45,670 --> 00:45:43,119
it's a it's a long subtitle but i think

1155
00:45:47,750 --> 00:45:45,680
it it underscores what the book is is

1156
00:45:49,750 --> 00:45:47,760
really about ultimately

1157
00:45:51,750 --> 00:45:49,760
yeah yeah we'll we'll go through we'll

1158
00:45:53,910 --> 00:45:51,760
go through that and this is the first

1159
00:45:55,829 --> 00:45:53,920
time you really dove into this topic

1160
00:45:56,950 --> 00:45:55,839
right have you have you written any

1161
00:45:58,390 --> 00:45:56,960
articles

1162
00:46:00,870 --> 00:45:58,400
i know you write written a lot of

1163
00:46:04,470 --> 00:46:00,880
articles in general but

1164
00:46:07,030 --> 00:46:04,480
you know i wrote a story about the media

1165
00:46:10,230 --> 00:46:07,040
media's failure to really

1166
00:46:12,309 --> 00:46:10,240
report honestly on this subject for a

1167
00:46:16,069 --> 00:46:12,319
special issue of

1168
00:46:17,349 --> 00:46:16,079
the utne reader which was produced here

1169
00:46:20,069 --> 00:46:17,359
from the

1170
00:46:23,670 --> 00:46:20,079
i think the early 80s and then uh

1171
00:46:26,150 --> 00:46:23,680
through the arts i think they folded

1172
00:46:28,710 --> 00:46:26,160
during the economic crisis but i think

1173
00:46:29,910 --> 00:46:28,720
it was 1998

1174
00:46:31,589 --> 00:46:29,920
maybe

1175
00:46:34,309 --> 00:46:31,599
i wrote a piece

1176
00:46:36,950 --> 00:46:34,319
um talking about the the failures of

1177
00:46:39,829 --> 00:46:36,960
media to cover this subject

1178
00:46:41,990 --> 00:46:39,839
without a wink and a nod and also

1179
00:46:44,630 --> 00:46:42,000
touched on how the secrecy might work

1180
00:46:46,790 --> 00:46:44,640
around it and why the secrecy

1181
00:46:49,510 --> 00:46:46,800
uh so i wrote that and also in the

1182
00:46:52,390 --> 00:46:49,520
run-up to the release of the june 25th

1183
00:46:54,790 --> 00:46:52,400
report this past summer

1184
00:46:57,109 --> 00:46:54,800
i wrote an op-ed piece for the star

1185
00:46:58,630 --> 00:46:57,119
tribune which is the paper record here

1186
00:47:01,430 --> 00:46:58,640
in minnesota

1187
00:47:02,630 --> 00:47:01,440
uh kind of outlining different scenarios

1188
00:47:04,710 --> 00:47:02,640
as to

1189
00:47:05,990 --> 00:47:04,720
what we should expect from the the

1190
00:47:08,069 --> 00:47:06,000
report and

1191
00:47:10,470 --> 00:47:08,079
and what different uh

1192
00:47:11,589 --> 00:47:10,480
viewpoints were on it from different uh

1193
00:47:13,190 --> 00:47:11,599
folks that

1194
00:47:15,349 --> 00:47:13,200
follow this topic

1195
00:47:20,309 --> 00:47:15,359
uh such as yourself

1196
00:47:26,390 --> 00:47:23,990
well um yeah you know you you were uh

1197
00:47:28,630 --> 00:47:26,400
actually writing early on you know but

1198
00:47:31,349 --> 00:47:28,640
you talk about 1990s

1199
00:47:34,950 --> 00:47:31,359
writing about how the media handled

1200
00:47:36,710 --> 00:47:34,960
handles this topic um you know i've only

1201
00:47:39,349 --> 00:47:36,720
been really seriously

1202
00:47:41,430 --> 00:47:39,359
in this topic for you know the ten years

1203
00:47:43,829 --> 00:47:41,440
that i've been doing the show basically

1204
00:47:45,750 --> 00:47:43,839
so i'm a newbie when it comes to that

1205
00:47:49,510 --> 00:47:45,760
but it sounds to me like you you've been

1206
00:47:53,829 --> 00:47:50,390
uh

1207
00:47:57,430 --> 00:47:53,839
is it all i'll set there

1208
00:48:04,230 --> 00:48:00,230
yeah well that happens

1209
00:48:07,270 --> 00:48:04,240
but really it's really something that uh

1210
00:48:09,109 --> 00:48:07,280
you know the media's finally

1211
00:48:10,549 --> 00:48:09,119
i want to say a good portion of the

1212
00:48:12,390 --> 00:48:10,559
media is finally

1213
00:48:14,069 --> 00:48:12,400
treating the subject a little bit better

1214
00:48:17,030 --> 00:48:14,079
but it it took

1215
00:48:18,549 --> 00:48:17,040
a a paper of such magnitude as the new

1216
00:48:21,670 --> 00:48:18,559
york times

1217
00:48:23,750 --> 00:48:21,680
to write a front page article to start

1218
00:48:25,430 --> 00:48:23,760
that ball rolling and there was a lot of

1219
00:48:26,549 --> 00:48:25,440
things behind the scenes that made that

1220
00:48:28,870 --> 00:48:26,559
happen too

1221
00:48:30,150 --> 00:48:28,880
yeah that 2017

1222
00:48:32,710 --> 00:48:30,160
excuse me that

1223
00:48:34,870 --> 00:48:32,720
december 2017

1224
00:48:38,790 --> 00:48:34,880
first new york times story

1225
00:48:41,670 --> 00:48:38,800
by leslie kane and robert blumenthal and

1226
00:48:44,470 --> 00:48:41,680
helena cooper i think yeah i mean that

1227
00:48:46,790 --> 00:48:44,480
that really uh that created the sea

1228
00:48:48,549 --> 00:48:46,800
change and then subsequently

1229
00:48:51,510 --> 00:48:48,559
the times i think

1230
00:48:54,630 --> 00:48:51,520
those same uh reporters they weren't

1231
00:48:56,230 --> 00:48:54,640
staffers but they were freelancers

1232
00:49:00,829 --> 00:48:56,240
they

1233
00:49:04,390 --> 00:49:00,839
and then of course

1234
00:49:07,030 --> 00:49:04,400
uh when uh all the uh when

1235
00:49:09,829 --> 00:49:07,040
harry reid exposed the the whole uh

1236
00:49:11,910 --> 00:49:09,839
organizational structure

1237
00:49:14,390 --> 00:49:11,920
that was handed off to bob bigelow to

1238
00:49:16,950 --> 00:49:14,400
look at these things out in vegas

1239
00:49:19,510 --> 00:49:16,960
with a 22 million dollar

1240
00:49:22,309 --> 00:49:19,520
uh budget uh when that

1241
00:49:24,710 --> 00:49:22,319
when that story really became widespread

1242
00:49:28,790 --> 00:49:24,720
then i think it got the attention of

1243
00:49:32,870 --> 00:49:31,030
and it's and it's kind of snowballed

1244
00:49:35,109 --> 00:49:32,880
from there while the

1245
00:49:37,670 --> 00:49:35,119
i think while the the government report

1246
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:37,680
of june 25th was a huge disappointment

1247
00:49:42,870 --> 00:49:40,240
and it was nine pages of disappointment

1248
00:49:45,109 --> 00:49:42,880
i downloaded the damn thing nine times

1249
00:49:47,829 --> 00:49:45,119
about five times thinking my computer

1250
00:49:51,430 --> 00:49:47,839
was glitching because i i was expecting

1251
00:49:53,990 --> 00:49:51,440
you know 20 to 50 to 70 pages

1252
00:49:55,910 --> 00:49:54,000
as i you know i'd read rumors in the in

1253
00:49:58,150 --> 00:49:55,920
the media that that it was going to be

1254
00:50:00,390 --> 00:49:58,160
that long and i think maybe perhaps the

1255
00:50:02,309 --> 00:50:00,400
classified section was

1256
00:50:05,270 --> 00:50:02,319
right now i've got my fingers crossed

1257
00:50:11,270 --> 00:50:08,549
that that classified section will be

1258
00:50:12,790 --> 00:50:11,280
will be leaked or somebody will blow the

1259
00:50:14,870 --> 00:50:12,800
whistle on it

1260
00:50:16,870 --> 00:50:14,880
and and that that subject about

1261
00:50:19,109 --> 00:50:16,880
disclosure is is covered pretty

1262
00:50:22,069 --> 00:50:19,119
extensively in the final two chapters of

1263
00:50:23,750 --> 00:50:22,079
the book chapters nine and ten

1264
00:50:26,069 --> 00:50:23,760
well you know we

1265
00:50:28,870 --> 00:50:26,079
uh i've said on this show and reminding

1266
00:50:31,910 --> 00:50:28,880
people that's the preliminary report but

1267
00:50:34,710 --> 00:50:31,920
now that this this has changed with this

1268
00:50:36,630 --> 00:50:34,720
bill that just passed um

1269
00:50:38,150 --> 00:50:36,640
i think you're going to see

1270
00:50:39,990 --> 00:50:38,160
that you know we're going to get an

1271
00:50:41,910 --> 00:50:40,000
annual report i'm hoping it's going to

1272
00:50:43,190 --> 00:50:41,920
be public i'd like to find

1273
00:50:44,470 --> 00:50:43,200
that out but you're right there is

1274
00:50:47,430 --> 00:50:44,480
certainly a difference between what's

1275
00:50:50,069 --> 00:50:47,440
classified and what's not classified and

1276
00:50:52,790 --> 00:50:50,079
you know i do believe

1277
00:50:55,349 --> 00:50:52,800
we have the right to know

1278
00:50:57,030 --> 00:50:55,359
what is going on and you know i mean i

1279
00:50:58,150 --> 00:50:57,040
totally do understand when something

1280
00:51:01,109 --> 00:50:58,160
would

1281
00:51:03,270 --> 00:51:01,119
you know jeopardize national security

1282
00:51:06,230 --> 00:51:03,280
in any type of way they can't release it

1283
00:51:08,790 --> 00:51:06,240
but we we should still be able to know

1284
00:51:10,549 --> 00:51:08,800
whatever they know barring anything that

1285
00:51:13,109 --> 00:51:10,559
would actually hurt

1286
00:51:15,510 --> 00:51:13,119
uh you know the integrity of our

1287
00:51:16,630 --> 00:51:15,520
our systems or anything like that

1288
00:51:18,470 --> 00:51:16,640
well

1289
00:51:20,230 --> 00:51:18,480
to your point into

1290
00:51:23,109 --> 00:51:20,240
you know some of the observations that

1291
00:51:25,109 --> 00:51:23,119
your previous guest bob salas just

1292
00:51:27,910 --> 00:51:25,119
shared with everyone

1293
00:51:29,910 --> 00:51:27,920
you know the national security

1294
00:51:32,309 --> 00:51:29,920
has been uh

1295
00:51:35,430 --> 00:51:32,319
interrupted or penetrated by these

1296
00:51:36,390 --> 00:51:35,440
objects as he described in maelstrom

1297
00:51:39,750 --> 00:51:36,400
and also

1298
00:51:41,589 --> 00:51:39,760
minot 1966 minots like you know 100

1299
00:51:43,030 --> 00:51:41,599
miles from where i grew up in dickinson

1300
00:51:46,309 --> 00:51:43,040
north dakota

1301
00:51:50,630 --> 00:51:48,390
does a pretty deep dive into that whole

1302
00:51:53,910 --> 00:51:50,640
minot air force base

1303
00:51:54,790 --> 00:51:53,920
incident as researched by a guy named

1304
00:51:59,990 --> 00:51:54,800
tom

1305
00:52:02,309 --> 00:52:00,000
you know a mile from me here in south

1306
00:52:04,870 --> 00:52:02,319
minneapolis we've become very good

1307
00:52:05,750 --> 00:52:04,880
friends over this issue tom did a hell

1308
00:52:10,549 --> 00:52:05,760
of a

1309
00:52:13,109 --> 00:52:10,559
minot incident

1310
00:52:15,190 --> 00:52:13,119
talked to not only uh

1311
00:52:17,190 --> 00:52:15,200
servicemen who were on the ground and

1312
00:52:18,630 --> 00:52:17,200
saw it but also the guys who are

1313
00:52:21,589 --> 00:52:18,640
actually

1314
00:52:23,030 --> 00:52:21,599
up in the air uh flying i forget what it

1315
00:52:25,670 --> 00:52:23,040
was a

1316
00:52:28,630 --> 00:52:25,680
a bomber aircraft of some kind

1317
00:52:31,270 --> 00:52:28,640
uh that also witnessed it and they were

1318
00:52:33,349 --> 00:52:31,280
you know reporting their radar

1319
00:52:36,309 --> 00:52:33,359
sightings on it and

1320
00:52:37,270 --> 00:52:36,319
that was a fairly dramatic incident

1321
00:52:39,430 --> 00:52:37,280
uh

1322
00:52:41,990 --> 00:52:39,440
left a couple of guys in a jeep on the

1323
00:52:44,069 --> 00:52:42,000
ground unconscious there were what

1324
00:52:45,510 --> 00:52:44,079
appeared to be radiation burns on the

1325
00:52:47,910 --> 00:52:45,520
hood of their jeep

1326
00:52:48,790 --> 00:52:47,920
they passed these two individuals passed

1327
00:52:52,470 --> 00:52:48,800
out

1328
00:52:56,390 --> 00:52:52,480
nobody seems to know why exactly and uh

1329
00:52:58,549 --> 00:52:56,400
as what happened in maelstrom

1330
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:58,559
the codes were scrambled on the silo

1331
00:53:02,230 --> 00:53:00,800
that this object was hovering over and

1332
00:53:06,549 --> 00:53:02,240
apparently

1333
00:53:09,750 --> 00:53:06,559
the 20-ton concrete block that that sat

1334
00:53:11,750 --> 00:53:09,760
up you know sat over the silo was moved

1335
00:53:14,309 --> 00:53:11,760
some sort of energy

1336
00:53:16,390 --> 00:53:14,319
i mean fantastic stuff but well

1337
00:53:18,470 --> 00:53:16,400
researched and uh

1338
00:53:21,270 --> 00:53:18,480
i excerpt quite a bit of that research

1339
00:53:23,349 --> 00:53:21,280
in in chapter four of the space pen club

1340
00:53:24,790 --> 00:53:23,359
book

1341
00:53:26,309 --> 00:53:24,800
yeah wow

1342
00:53:28,790 --> 00:53:26,319
all good stuff we're going to continue

1343
00:53:31,109 --> 00:53:28,800
this conversation we're going into break

1344
00:53:34,790 --> 00:53:31,119
now so if you're over at

1345
00:53:37,190 --> 00:53:34,800
uh kg r a radio uh hang in there for

1346
00:53:39,670 --> 00:53:37,200
after these messages everywhere else

1347
00:53:41,430 --> 00:53:39,680
you're gonna get to hear my friend linda

1348
00:53:43,750 --> 00:53:41,440
zimmerman talk about

1349
00:53:49,030 --> 00:53:43,760
what is happening in pine bush we'll be

1350
00:53:53,829 --> 00:53:50,870
why do you think they're here and what

1351
00:53:55,109 --> 00:53:53,839
do they want in pine bush in particular

1352
00:53:58,230 --> 00:53:55,119
okay

1353
00:54:00,549 --> 00:53:58,240
i think from the records that they have

1354
00:54:01,750 --> 00:54:00,559
been here for hundreds if not thousands

1355
00:54:04,470 --> 00:54:01,760
of years

1356
00:54:07,670 --> 00:54:04,480
and native americans have stories about

1357
00:54:10,390 --> 00:54:07,680
strange lights and objects

1358
00:54:13,589 --> 00:54:10,400
why the hudson valley

1359
00:54:15,829 --> 00:54:13,599
we have very unusual magnetic fields we

1360
00:54:18,549 --> 00:54:15,839
have fault lines we have unusual

1361
00:54:20,069 --> 00:54:18,559
minerals perhaps it's something they can

1362
00:54:22,470 --> 00:54:20,079
utilize

1363
00:54:27,990 --> 00:54:22,480
would that fall under

1364
00:54:30,309 --> 00:54:28,000
here what they want

1365
00:54:33,349 --> 00:54:30,319
i think it might fall under

1366
00:54:34,710 --> 00:54:33,359
what they want is to

1367
00:54:37,190 --> 00:54:34,720
study us

1368
00:54:40,150 --> 00:54:37,200
and perhaps utilize the natural

1369
00:54:42,549 --> 00:54:40,160
resources of the earth in this area

1370
00:54:44,470 --> 00:54:42,559
and for all the sightings that have been

1371
00:54:46,710 --> 00:54:44,480
in this particular area let's just say

1372
00:54:47,589 --> 00:54:46,720
the pine bush area not hudson valley in

1373
00:54:49,270 --> 00:54:47,599
general

1374
00:54:51,670 --> 00:54:49,280
what do you think is the most well

1375
00:54:54,470 --> 00:54:51,680
documented of all the

1376
00:54:55,589 --> 00:54:54,480
the ufo encounters here

1377
00:54:58,150 --> 00:54:55,599
uh

1378
00:55:01,109 --> 00:54:58,160
probably some of the mass sightings of

1379
00:55:04,630 --> 00:55:01,119
triangles which would be seen

1380
00:55:06,950 --> 00:55:04,640
from one end of town to the other by

1381
00:55:09,750 --> 00:55:06,960
hundreds of people and this happened

1382
00:55:12,950 --> 00:55:09,760
quite often in the 1990s

1383
00:55:15,589 --> 00:55:12,960
so we have not one event

1384
00:55:17,750 --> 00:55:15,599
we have multiple events of multiple

1385
00:55:19,349 --> 00:55:17,760
witnesses

1386
00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:19,359
and what about

1387
00:55:24,710 --> 00:55:21,520
what about beings if it's anyone ever

1388
00:55:28,710 --> 00:55:24,720
talked about beings of any kind

1389
00:55:31,349 --> 00:55:28,720
a lot of grave sightings uh in this area

1390
00:55:33,829 --> 00:55:31,359
some very unusual cryptids but you know

1391
00:55:36,710 --> 00:55:33,839
you take all those with a grain of salt

1392
00:55:39,829 --> 00:55:36,720
um but people who didn't know what an

1393
00:55:42,710 --> 00:55:39,839
alien was have described to me and you

1394
00:55:44,390 --> 00:55:42,720
know i saw this small gray being with

1395
00:55:46,549 --> 00:55:44,400
big black eyes

1396
00:55:49,750 --> 00:55:46,559
and you hear that

1397
00:55:52,710 --> 00:55:49,760
20 30 100 times

1398
00:55:53,510 --> 00:55:52,720
it's it makes an impression

1399
00:55:56,390 --> 00:55:53,520
and

1400
00:55:58,549 --> 00:55:56,400
what about the abduction part of this

1401
00:56:01,589 --> 00:55:58,559
are there people reporting abductions

1402
00:56:04,549 --> 00:56:01,599
and the second part of the question is

1403
00:56:06,510 --> 00:56:04,559
is it a another family lineage type of

1404
00:56:09,270 --> 00:56:06,520
situation

1405
00:56:10,309 --> 00:56:09,280
multi-generational for sure

1406
00:56:12,630 --> 00:56:10,319
and

1407
00:56:13,829 --> 00:56:12,640
i was stunned when i first started my

1408
00:56:15,910 --> 00:56:13,839
research

1409
00:56:18,230 --> 00:56:15,920
i didn't expect to come across a single

1410
00:56:19,589 --> 00:56:18,240
abduction they're the largest chapters

1411
00:56:20,789 --> 00:56:19,599
in my book

1412
00:56:24,309 --> 00:56:20,799
it's

1413
00:56:25,910 --> 00:56:24,319
i call a hudson valley abduction alley

1414
00:56:27,510 --> 00:56:25,920
really

1415
00:56:29,510 --> 00:56:27,520
well thank you so much linda it's always

1416
00:56:31,349 --> 00:56:29,520
a pleasure and great to see you here

1417
00:56:46,309 --> 00:56:31,359
thank you i'm glad you finally made it

1418
00:56:46,319 --> 00:56:57,750
stand by martin

1419
00:57:03,510 --> 00:57:01,510
in three two one go

1420
00:57:06,069 --> 00:57:03,520
all right welcome back uh this is martin

1421
00:57:08,630 --> 00:57:06,079
willis our guest is martin keller and

1422
00:57:09,510 --> 00:57:08,640
he's talking about his book uh that was

1423
00:57:11,670 --> 00:57:09,520
uh

1424
00:57:13,829 --> 00:57:11,680
recently published and we'll bring him

1425
00:57:15,670 --> 00:57:13,839
right back in you saw that for those of

1426
00:57:18,470 --> 00:57:15,680
you watching on facebook

1427
00:57:20,710 --> 00:57:18,480
um you heard or if you listen darty or

1428
00:57:23,589 --> 00:57:20,720
you heard that clip three minute clip um

1429
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:23,599
so i would love to uh interview someone

1430
00:57:28,150 --> 00:57:25,920
who had a ufo sighting if you'd like to

1431
00:57:31,589 --> 00:57:28,160
fill in those uh three minute gaps my

1432
00:57:34,230 --> 00:57:31,599
emails martin podcast ufo.com i'll talk

1433
00:57:35,829 --> 00:57:34,240
to you first and see how uh how i think

1434
00:57:37,910 --> 00:57:35,839
it would work and then

1435
00:57:40,309 --> 00:57:37,920
would be glad to to

1436
00:57:42,710 --> 00:57:40,319
bring you on board and run these clips

1437
00:57:43,589 --> 00:57:42,720
it's an idea i'm gonna try it see what

1438
00:57:45,829 --> 00:57:43,599
happens

1439
00:57:48,470 --> 00:57:45,839
welcome back martin

1440
00:57:49,670 --> 00:57:48,480
thank you the martin and martin again

1441
00:57:53,510 --> 00:57:49,680
um

1442
00:57:58,470 --> 00:57:56,150
well yes and uh so in a half hour we're

1443
00:58:01,349 --> 00:57:58,480
going to be taking calls so those of you

1444
00:58:03,910 --> 00:58:01,359
who are in chat if you're uh leaving

1445
00:58:05,589 --> 00:58:03,920
comments that i missed uh

1446
00:58:07,190 --> 00:58:05,599
you're welcome to call in that number

1447
00:58:08,950 --> 00:58:07,200
will be posted in about a half hour or

1448
00:58:10,549 --> 00:58:08,960
so so we're taking calls bill will be

1449
00:58:11,270 --> 00:58:10,559
screening those calls

1450
00:58:13,750 --> 00:58:11,280
and

1451
00:58:15,349 --> 00:58:13,760
so how how's your book being received by

1452
00:58:17,270 --> 00:58:15,359
the way

1453
00:58:19,910 --> 00:58:17,280
well it's hard to know it's been out

1454
00:58:23,510 --> 00:58:19,920
since about mid-june uh it's getting

1455
00:58:26,069 --> 00:58:23,520
some great reviews on amazon where you

1456
00:58:28,549 --> 00:58:26,079
can purchase it and

1457
00:58:30,309 --> 00:58:28,559
you know i've yet to really crack the

1458
00:58:32,870 --> 00:58:30,319
the mainstream

1459
00:58:35,589 --> 00:58:32,880
media in terms of coverage and or future

1460
00:58:38,150 --> 00:58:35,599
stories but i think the social media

1461
00:58:39,670 --> 00:58:38,160
buzz on it is good the personal buzz on

1462
00:58:41,829 --> 00:58:39,680
it is good

1463
00:58:44,230 --> 00:58:41,839
um i don't think there's re you know

1464
00:58:46,150 --> 00:58:44,240
there's been hundreds of ufo books

1465
00:58:47,990 --> 00:58:46,160
written but i i don't think there's been

1466
00:58:50,390 --> 00:58:48,000
a book like mine

1467
00:58:53,589 --> 00:58:50,400
that that's ever been published i mean

1468
00:58:56,710 --> 00:58:53,599
it's it really goes inside the ufo

1469
00:58:58,549 --> 00:58:56,720
subculture where we meet ufo researchers

1470
00:59:01,030 --> 00:58:58,559
and they're debunkers we meet

1471
00:59:03,510 --> 00:59:01,040
individuals from the aviary who i'm sure

1472
00:59:06,470 --> 00:59:03,520
you've talked about on this program

1473
00:59:07,990 --> 00:59:06,480
if not we can clarify what what that who

1474
00:59:09,990 --> 00:59:08,000
that group is

1475
00:59:12,150 --> 00:59:10,000
you know there's also close interactions

1476
00:59:15,430 --> 00:59:12,160
with media and government officials

1477
00:59:18,150 --> 00:59:15,440
celebrated astronauts like uh

1478
00:59:22,230 --> 00:59:18,160
ed mitchell six men to walk on the on

1479
00:59:25,589 --> 00:59:22,240
the moon part of the apollo 14 crew

1480
00:59:28,630 --> 00:59:25,599
uh brian o'leary who was designated for

1481
00:59:31,190 --> 00:59:28,640
the mars missions uh when the when the

1482
00:59:33,750 --> 00:59:31,200
mars program was first announced at nasa

1483
00:59:35,589 --> 00:59:33,760
and then subsequent subsequently

1484
00:59:38,630 --> 00:59:35,599
scrubbed

1485
00:59:42,870 --> 00:59:38,640
also a funny anecdote in the book about

1486
00:59:47,030 --> 00:59:44,829
about the same i met him at

1487
00:59:49,270 --> 00:59:47,040
a had a

1488
00:59:51,109 --> 00:59:49,280
benefit a gala

1489
00:59:53,270 --> 00:59:51,119
occasion for the starkey hearing

1490
00:59:55,430 --> 00:59:53,280
foundation that i was doing some public

1491
00:59:56,630 --> 00:59:55,440
relations work for

1492
00:59:59,109 --> 00:59:56,640
and uh

1493
01:00:01,670 --> 00:59:59,119
philip corso's book had just come out

1494
01:00:03,670 --> 01:00:01,680
the day after roswell the controversial

1495
01:00:04,789 --> 01:00:03,680
book corso wrote

1496
01:00:08,390 --> 01:00:04,799
and uh

1497
01:00:10,150 --> 01:00:08,400
i had a i had a quiet moment with buzz

1498
01:00:12,950 --> 01:00:10,160
on on a couch

1499
01:00:14,710 --> 01:00:12,960
as we were sipping cocktails and i asked

1500
01:00:16,950 --> 01:00:14,720
him i said you know this book just came

1501
01:00:19,589 --> 01:00:16,960
out by a guy named colonel phil of

1502
01:00:20,870 --> 01:00:19,599
course who has a really renowned

1503
01:00:23,349 --> 01:00:20,880
uh

1504
01:00:26,230 --> 01:00:23,359
history of service dating back to world

1505
01:00:28,069 --> 01:00:26,240
war ii and the liberation of italy and

1506
01:00:30,150 --> 01:00:28,079
you know his decorated colonel

1507
01:00:32,710 --> 01:00:30,160
lieutenant colonel and uh

1508
01:00:35,589 --> 01:00:32,720
he says that that roswell happened and

1509
01:00:38,150 --> 01:00:35,599
then all the technology was

1510
01:00:39,990 --> 01:00:38,160
was seated to private enterprise and

1511
01:00:42,309 --> 01:00:40,000
they hold the patents on a lot of this

1512
01:00:44,390 --> 01:00:42,319
stuff and what do you think of that buzz

1513
01:00:48,150 --> 01:00:44,400
and buzz

1514
01:00:49,829 --> 01:00:48,160
buzz put his hands together like this

1515
01:00:51,030 --> 01:00:49,839
look me straight in the eye and he goes

1516
01:00:53,270 --> 01:00:51,040
son

1517
01:00:54,069 --> 01:00:53,280
i don't know anything about that

1518
01:00:57,109 --> 01:00:54,079
and

1519
01:00:59,190 --> 01:00:57,119
that's the complete subtext was uh don't

1520
01:01:01,510 --> 01:00:59,200
ever ask me a question like that again

1521
01:01:03,349 --> 01:01:01,520
and it's funny because about it ten days

1522
01:01:05,349 --> 01:01:03,359
later i read in the newspaper where he

1523
01:01:08,069 --> 01:01:05,359
slugged somebody on the street who had

1524
01:01:10,309 --> 01:01:08,079
approached him and asked him about the

1525
01:01:12,630 --> 01:01:10,319
quote-unquote fake moon landing and he

1526
01:01:14,390 --> 01:01:12,640
didn't even respond with a with a quote

1527
01:01:16,309 --> 01:01:14,400
like the one he gave me just slugged the

1528
01:01:19,670 --> 01:01:16,319
guy and kept moving

1529
01:01:23,430 --> 01:01:19,680
wow yeah no i i saw an interview with

1530
01:01:25,510 --> 01:01:23,440
buzz where someone was asking him about

1531
01:01:28,150 --> 01:01:25,520
they they said well let's talk about

1532
01:01:30,069 --> 01:01:28,160
your ufo psych and he got really angry

1533
01:01:32,870 --> 01:01:30,079
he didn't he didn't talk didn't talk

1534
01:01:35,670 --> 01:01:32,880
about it and i i had spoken i played the

1535
01:01:39,030 --> 01:01:35,680
clip on this show at some point where i

1536
01:01:41,670 --> 01:01:39,040
had spoke many years ago

1537
01:01:44,069 --> 01:01:41,680
to alan bean the fourth man on the moon

1538
01:01:46,950 --> 01:01:44,079
and uh he

1539
01:01:48,549 --> 01:01:46,960
he says as far as people saying

1540
01:01:50,309 --> 01:01:48,559
that they never landed on the moon he

1541
01:01:52,870 --> 01:01:50,319
says you can't change people's mind just

1542
01:01:54,950 --> 01:01:52,880
let them think what they want you know

1543
01:01:56,630 --> 01:01:54,960
just move on uh yeah if you're gonna

1544
01:01:58,789 --> 01:01:56,640
take it personal like that you know i

1545
01:02:01,109 --> 01:01:58,799
mean uh you're not gonna change anyone's

1546
01:02:03,190 --> 01:02:01,119
mind a slug in the slug in the nose

1547
01:02:06,470 --> 01:02:03,200
isn't gonna change anyone's mind either

1548
01:02:09,109 --> 01:02:06,480
they're gonna say that's proof

1549
01:02:11,589 --> 01:02:09,119
yeah yeah uh so yeah he could he can be

1550
01:02:13,029 --> 01:02:11,599
a little bit rough and i know that uh he

1551
01:02:14,470 --> 01:02:13,039
definitely at that one particular

1552
01:02:15,990 --> 01:02:14,480
interview that i saw him and he did not

1553
01:02:17,430 --> 01:02:16,000
want to talk about

1554
01:02:19,589 --> 01:02:17,440
um

1555
01:02:23,270 --> 01:02:19,599
a supposed encounter that he may or may

1556
01:02:24,870 --> 01:02:23,280
not have had i'm not really sure

1557
01:02:27,349 --> 01:02:24,880
what the story was on that you know

1558
01:02:30,549 --> 01:02:27,359
those guys were i'm sure

1559
01:02:32,630 --> 01:02:30,559
had signed a bunch of uh

1560
01:02:34,870 --> 01:02:32,640
the military equivalent of an nda

1561
01:02:37,029 --> 01:02:34,880
non-disclosure agreements i mean i i

1562
01:02:40,309 --> 01:02:37,039
think they were all paper

1563
01:02:42,789 --> 01:02:40,319
papered over with uh security clearances

1564
01:02:43,829 --> 01:02:42,799
and secrecy oaths and you know they're

1565
01:02:48,069 --> 01:02:43,839
not

1566
01:02:51,910 --> 01:02:48,079
they could have lost their pensions and

1567
01:02:53,910 --> 01:02:51,920
and some of their stripes so

1568
01:02:56,950 --> 01:02:53,920
it's not surprising really that that

1569
01:03:00,390 --> 01:02:56,960
generation of astronauts would would

1570
01:03:01,190 --> 01:03:00,400
feel that way or or hold that persona

1571
01:03:03,750 --> 01:03:01,200
out

1572
01:03:06,950 --> 01:03:03,760
to the public so it's

1573
01:03:09,670 --> 01:03:06,960
but you know i think it's a new day

1574
01:03:11,829 --> 01:03:09,680
i wanted to i wanted to circle back to

1575
01:03:13,109 --> 01:03:11,839
something that that we touched on

1576
01:03:14,870 --> 01:03:13,119
earlier that

1577
01:03:17,430 --> 01:03:14,880
and also that

1578
01:03:19,190 --> 01:03:17,440
bob sells his upcoming disclosure event

1579
01:03:21,029 --> 01:03:19,200
in washington you know

1580
01:03:24,069 --> 01:03:21,039
andrea carson

1581
01:03:26,230 --> 01:03:24,079
the democrat from indiana uh

1582
01:03:27,990 --> 01:03:26,240
called for hearings open hearings on

1583
01:03:31,029 --> 01:03:28,000
this in the congress

1584
01:03:33,349 --> 01:03:31,039
at the time the report came out so

1585
01:03:37,109 --> 01:03:33,359
it's gonna be an interesting next six to

1586
01:03:37,910 --> 01:03:37,119
nine months i think in this in this area

1587
01:03:39,750 --> 01:03:37,920
uh

1588
01:03:42,710 --> 01:03:39,760
again though i think a lot of that will

1589
01:03:45,270 --> 01:03:42,720
depend on on what else is jamming up the

1590
01:03:47,109 --> 01:03:45,280
news cycle

1591
01:03:49,190 --> 01:03:47,119
it's going to be hard to top the run up

1592
01:03:51,510 --> 01:03:49,200
to that report though i mean i was i was

1593
01:03:53,029 --> 01:03:51,520
just astounded at the amount of media

1594
01:03:54,549 --> 01:03:53,039
coverage

1595
01:03:56,710 --> 01:03:54,559
in my book you know i

1596
01:04:00,150 --> 01:03:56,720
i talked pretty extensively in one of

1597
01:04:01,990 --> 01:04:00,160
the chapters about the failure of media

1598
01:04:04,789 --> 01:04:02,000
and i use a

1599
01:04:06,870 --> 01:04:04,799
real life experience

1600
01:04:08,390 --> 01:04:06,880
with greer's organization when we were

1601
01:04:10,309 --> 01:04:08,400
in mexico

1602
01:04:14,630 --> 01:04:10,319
in the volcano zone

1603
01:04:17,190 --> 01:04:14,640
and we were shadowed by a cbs news crew

1604
01:04:20,069 --> 01:04:17,200
from 48 hours and they were doing an

1605
01:04:24,710 --> 01:04:20,079
entire show dedicated to the ufo issue

1606
01:04:30,309 --> 01:04:27,109
and

1607
01:04:32,309 --> 01:04:30,319
they basically made us look like

1608
01:04:34,710 --> 01:04:32,319
gringo rubes

1609
01:04:37,589 --> 01:04:34,720
wandering around this pretty rugged

1610
01:04:40,150 --> 01:04:37,599
terrain under the volcano it's an active

1611
01:04:43,270 --> 01:04:40,160
volcano in mexico second largest in

1612
01:04:45,750 --> 01:04:43,280
north america it's called mount popo by

1613
01:04:47,950 --> 01:04:45,760
the locals it's it's an old

1614
01:04:50,470 --> 01:04:47,960
the aztecs named it uh

1615
01:04:53,270 --> 01:04:50,480
popocatepetl which i'm sure i'm not

1616
01:04:55,589 --> 01:04:53,280
pronouncing that right but

1617
01:04:57,589 --> 01:04:55,599
that little adventure uh

1618
01:05:03,990 --> 01:04:57,599
really

1619
01:05:05,190 --> 01:05:04,000
other ufo enthusiasts about what a lousy

1620
01:05:08,069 --> 01:05:05,200
job

1621
01:05:09,510 --> 01:05:08,079
media did in handling this but i i also

1622
01:05:10,710 --> 01:05:09,520
in that chapter

1623
01:05:13,190 --> 01:05:10,720
delved pretty

1624
01:05:15,670 --> 01:05:13,200
extensively into terry hansen's book i

1625
01:05:19,430 --> 01:05:15,680
don't know if you're familiar with that

1626
01:05:21,670 --> 01:05:19,440
yes in times fantastic book i mean

1627
01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:21,680
if you want an introduction to how

1628
01:05:26,470 --> 01:05:24,000
number one how the news media works or

1629
01:05:29,589 --> 01:05:26,480
doesn't work especially on marginalized

1630
01:05:30,630 --> 01:05:29,599
subjects like ufos they're paranormal

1631
01:05:34,309 --> 01:05:30,640
this is

1632
01:05:37,349 --> 01:05:34,319
out of print but the last time i looked

1633
01:05:40,470 --> 01:05:37,359
you could buy used copies

1634
01:05:41,829 --> 01:05:40,480
hansen did a fabulous job of of

1635
01:05:42,710 --> 01:05:41,839
researching

1636
01:05:44,150 --> 01:05:42,720
different

1637
01:05:46,390 --> 01:05:44,160
instances

1638
01:05:47,670 --> 01:05:46,400
of major ufo sightings including

1639
01:05:51,029 --> 01:05:47,680
maelstrom

1640
01:05:54,069 --> 01:05:51,039
and really lays out a case that uh

1641
01:05:56,789 --> 01:05:54,079
the news media has infiltrated with

1642
01:05:59,109 --> 01:05:56,799
either former or current cia agents and

1643
01:05:59,990 --> 01:05:59,119
other you know information operatives

1644
01:06:03,109 --> 01:06:00,000
who

1645
01:06:05,349 --> 01:06:03,119
have colored or and or prevented

1646
01:06:08,069 --> 01:06:05,359
true coverage or investigation of this

1647
01:06:09,430 --> 01:06:08,079
subject probably on national security

1648
01:06:11,670 --> 01:06:09,440
grounds and

1649
01:06:14,230 --> 01:06:11,680
and you know i get into this discussion

1650
01:06:16,549 --> 01:06:14,240
with friends and uh interviewers like

1651
01:06:19,510 --> 01:06:16,559
yourself on occasion about

1652
01:06:21,829 --> 01:06:19,520
you know why is it why has it been such

1653
01:06:24,390 --> 01:06:21,839
such poor reporting on this when you've

1654
01:06:26,630 --> 01:06:24,400
got all these citizens groups who are

1655
01:06:28,069 --> 01:06:26,640
constantly doing great research in the

1656
01:06:29,910 --> 01:06:28,079
field and you've

1657
01:06:32,710 --> 01:06:29,920
you know you've got foia documents

1658
01:06:35,109 --> 01:06:32,720
coming out and stuff like that and i

1659
01:06:37,270 --> 01:06:35,119
said well look on the one hand

1660
01:06:37,990 --> 01:06:37,280
uh i agree with you but on the other

1661
01:06:39,910 --> 01:06:38,000
hand

1662
01:06:43,430 --> 01:06:39,920
you know i'm a little sympathetic to

1663
01:06:45,190 --> 01:06:43,440
toward the media because only because

1664
01:06:46,710 --> 01:06:45,200
they don't have any official sources

1665
01:06:48,309 --> 01:06:46,720
they can go to

1666
01:06:49,510 --> 01:06:48,319
and they have not had any official

1667
01:06:51,430 --> 01:06:49,520
sources

1668
01:06:54,549 --> 01:06:51,440
you know they've had to rely on major

1669
01:06:56,150 --> 01:06:54,559
events like the washington dc flyover in

1670
01:06:58,150 --> 01:06:56,160
52 where

1671
01:07:00,230 --> 01:06:58,160
the big brass had to come out and hold

1672
01:07:02,230 --> 01:07:00,240
their largest press conference ever

1673
01:07:04,789 --> 01:07:02,240
since world war ii

1674
01:07:07,109 --> 01:07:04,799
and say you know uh we have this under

1675
01:07:09,589 --> 01:07:07,119
control we we don't know what it is

1676
01:07:12,870 --> 01:07:09,599
probably a weather inversion so yeah

1677
01:07:17,670 --> 01:07:15,109
but i'm thinking with the establishment

1678
01:07:21,029 --> 01:07:17,680
of this new office that that maybe now

1679
01:07:24,230 --> 01:07:21,039
there will be a media point person

1680
01:07:26,309 --> 01:07:24,240
who can address this with with uh

1681
01:07:28,069 --> 01:07:26,319
at least some candor if not some real

1682
01:07:29,430 --> 01:07:28,079
information

1683
01:07:32,789 --> 01:07:29,440
that would be

1684
01:07:36,069 --> 01:07:32,799
wonderful if if there they would

1685
01:07:38,630 --> 01:07:36,079
assign you know a press person

1686
01:07:40,789 --> 01:07:38,640
and i mean it it seems to me

1687
01:07:43,510 --> 01:07:40,799
that it's important enough to keep the

1688
01:07:45,670 --> 01:07:43,520
relations between the people

1689
01:07:47,589 --> 01:07:45,680
and their office

1690
01:07:49,109 --> 01:07:47,599
those channels open because there's

1691
01:07:50,870 --> 01:07:49,119
actually going to be you know there's

1692
01:07:52,630 --> 01:07:50,880
people that can assist too there's

1693
01:07:54,230 --> 01:07:52,640
plenty of people that are very

1694
01:07:56,390 --> 01:07:54,240
interested in this topic

1695
01:07:58,230 --> 01:07:56,400
that really give a lot of themselves and

1696
01:08:00,470 --> 01:07:58,240
their time and information

1697
01:08:02,549 --> 01:08:00,480
you know and uh there there's also

1698
01:08:04,950 --> 01:08:02,559
factions that kind of go off on each

1699
01:08:06,390 --> 01:08:04,960
other too but still you know there's a

1700
01:08:08,950 --> 01:08:06,400
lot of people that wouldn't mind helping

1701
01:08:11,589 --> 01:08:08,960
out in in my opinion

1702
01:08:13,510 --> 01:08:11,599
but um now one of the reasons i wrote

1703
01:08:15,829 --> 01:08:13,520
the book aside from the fact that i'm

1704
01:08:18,550 --> 01:08:15,839
getting up in years and i i didn't want

1705
01:08:20,550 --> 01:08:18,560
to lose my memories or my research

1706
01:08:23,590 --> 01:08:20,560
to time um

1707
01:08:26,390 --> 01:08:23,600
you know the the ufo community or or the

1708
01:08:29,269 --> 01:08:26,400
ghetto as greer famously calls it

1709
01:08:31,829 --> 01:08:29,279
uh is a fascinating place where these

1710
01:08:33,910 --> 01:08:31,839
factions do exist and

1711
01:08:36,229 --> 01:08:33,920
the interactions among them are are

1712
01:08:38,630 --> 01:08:36,239
sometimes really eye-opening but they're

1713
01:08:41,110 --> 01:08:38,640
also sometimes very amusing

1714
01:08:43,349 --> 01:08:41,120
and to a a former journalist i mean

1715
01:08:45,189 --> 01:08:43,359
these are i had some great stories to

1716
01:08:47,269 --> 01:08:45,199
tell and a lot of them are in this book

1717
01:08:48,990 --> 01:08:47,279
about about the

1718
01:08:51,990 --> 01:08:49,000
sort of uh

1719
01:08:53,749 --> 01:08:52,000
territorial uh

1720
01:08:56,550 --> 01:08:53,759
ground that's staked out by different

1721
01:08:58,870 --> 01:08:56,560
groups and you know trying to determine

1722
01:09:01,269 --> 01:08:58,880
what's real and what's not and

1723
01:09:02,229 --> 01:09:01,279
whose disclosure is better than yours i

1724
01:09:04,390 --> 01:09:02,239
mean it's

1725
01:09:06,390 --> 01:09:04,400
it's kind of never-ending i

1726
01:09:09,269 --> 01:09:06,400
i joke in the book

1727
01:09:11,910 --> 01:09:09,279
but i'm also half serious that this book

1728
01:09:14,709 --> 01:09:11,920
the space pen club book is

1729
01:09:18,149 --> 01:09:14,719
is my farewell to ufology but as i'm

1730
01:09:19,749 --> 01:09:18,159
finding out it's it's probably not

1731
01:09:21,749 --> 01:09:19,759
because i've had a couple of high

1732
01:09:24,550 --> 01:09:21,759
strangeness events

1733
01:09:26,229 --> 01:09:24,560
uh since it's been published and we

1734
01:09:28,189 --> 01:09:26,239
don't need to go into those today i

1735
01:09:30,390 --> 01:09:28,199
might blog about it on

1736
01:09:32,229 --> 01:09:30,400
thespacepenclub.com where i'm trying to

1737
01:09:34,550 --> 01:09:32,239
blog at least once a week and stay

1738
01:09:36,950 --> 01:09:34,560
current on on issues

1739
01:09:39,110 --> 01:09:36,960
breaking news like this uh

1740
01:09:42,229 --> 01:09:39,120
recent bill passed by

1741
01:09:46,470 --> 01:09:42,239
galio is a galilego is that his name

1742
01:09:51,749 --> 01:09:49,110
you mentioned uh terry hansen

1743
01:09:54,070 --> 01:09:51,759
earlier just a few minutes ago and and

1744
01:09:56,470 --> 01:09:54,080
terry hansen was a really nice guy he

1745
01:09:58,870 --> 01:09:56,480
was on this show a couple of times years

1746
01:10:00,470 --> 01:09:58,880
ago and unfortunately he passed away

1747
01:10:03,110 --> 01:10:00,480
young he was young when he passed away

1748
01:10:06,149 --> 01:10:03,120
and yeah 2014.

1749
01:10:08,790 --> 01:10:06,159
um yeah that was a sad day but he also

1750
01:10:11,669 --> 01:10:08,800
looked really deeply into the robertson

1751
01:10:12,709 --> 01:10:11,679
panel of 1953. right and that's

1752
01:10:14,630 --> 01:10:12,719
basically

1753
01:10:16,630 --> 01:10:14,640
the initiation of

1754
01:10:18,550 --> 01:10:16,640
of the fringe

1755
01:10:20,870 --> 01:10:18,560
uh element added

1756
01:10:22,229 --> 01:10:20,880
to this topic to keep people from taking

1757
01:10:23,669 --> 01:10:22,239
it seriously

1758
01:10:24,950 --> 01:10:23,679
so uh

1759
01:10:26,310 --> 01:10:24,960
the new listener out there that's

1760
01:10:28,709 --> 01:10:26,320
there's a really good book that terry

1761
01:10:30,550 --> 01:10:28,719
hansen wrote on that you know i'm not

1762
01:10:32,550 --> 01:10:30,560
100 sure if you wrote a book on that he

1763
01:10:33,990 --> 01:10:32,560
used to talk on my show about it but i'm

1764
01:10:37,350 --> 01:10:34,000
not sure if he wrote i think he

1765
01:10:39,110 --> 01:10:37,360
referenced the robertson panel uh and

1766
01:10:40,790 --> 01:10:39,120
for those not familiar with that the

1767
01:10:43,030 --> 01:10:40,800
panel really

1768
01:10:45,830 --> 01:10:43,040
established the uh

1769
01:10:49,030 --> 01:10:45,840
the ground rules for dealing publicly

1770
01:10:52,229 --> 01:10:49,040
with media and and ufo

1771
01:10:53,189 --> 01:10:52,239
reports and those who reported them

1772
01:11:00,390 --> 01:10:53,199
their

1773
01:11:01,669 --> 01:11:00,400
secondly to ridicule those who who uh

1774
01:11:04,070 --> 01:11:01,679
who made these

1775
01:11:06,390 --> 01:11:04,080
these reports of sightings and that's

1776
01:11:07,510 --> 01:11:06,400
been very effective it's very effective

1777
01:11:10,310 --> 01:11:07,520
through

1778
01:11:11,510 --> 01:11:10,320
many decades and

1779
01:11:14,390 --> 01:11:11,520
when i was

1780
01:11:17,669 --> 01:11:14,400
you know working on the book

1781
01:11:20,550 --> 01:11:17,679
i discovered that a lot of the uh

1782
01:11:23,350 --> 01:11:20,560
robertson panel history is now posted i

1783
01:11:26,149 --> 01:11:23,360
think on the cia's website so

1784
01:11:27,350 --> 01:11:26,159
there's little disclosures going on from

1785
01:11:30,310 --> 01:11:27,360
these

1786
01:11:32,790 --> 01:11:30,320
you know ironclad towers where

1787
01:11:34,390 --> 01:11:32,800
where the secrets are kept

1788
01:11:36,070 --> 01:11:34,400
um

1789
01:11:38,709 --> 01:11:36,080
and you don't have to look that hard to

1790
01:11:44,630 --> 01:11:41,669
yeah yeah um yes i know a lot of it like

1791
01:11:46,790 --> 01:11:44,640
you said his books uh that are are out

1792
01:11:47,590 --> 01:11:46,800
of print um

1793
01:11:49,590 --> 01:11:47,600
now

1794
01:11:50,470 --> 01:11:49,600
uh as far as

1795
01:11:53,669 --> 01:11:50,480
the

1796
01:11:56,149 --> 01:11:53,679
uh dr greer i know i i talked a little

1797
01:11:58,709 --> 01:11:56,159
bit offline about this i have

1798
01:12:01,430 --> 01:11:58,719
uh many times criticized him on the show

1799
01:12:04,070 --> 01:12:01,440
to be honest with you but but you had

1800
01:12:06,149 --> 01:12:04,080
some dealings uh with his

1801
01:12:08,070 --> 01:12:06,159
seasetti

1802
01:12:10,070 --> 01:12:08,080
uh

1803
01:12:11,510 --> 01:12:10,080
situation now

1804
01:12:12,790 --> 01:12:11,520
you want to fill us in a little bit on

1805
01:12:15,669 --> 01:12:12,800
that

1806
01:12:18,790 --> 01:12:15,679
yeah and and in our offline discussion i

1807
01:12:20,950 --> 01:12:18,800
i uh said you know steve greer is a

1808
01:12:23,110 --> 01:12:20,960
highly polarizing

1809
01:12:24,229 --> 01:12:23,120
uh figure

1810
01:12:26,229 --> 01:12:24,239
uh

1811
01:12:28,870 --> 01:12:26,239
when i first met him

1812
01:12:30,390 --> 01:12:28,880
he had just formed sea city and i i was

1813
01:12:33,590 --> 01:12:30,400
coming

1814
01:12:34,830 --> 01:12:33,600
at him and his organization to profile

1815
01:12:38,470 --> 01:12:34,840
and

1816
01:12:40,550 --> 01:12:38,480
um the more time i spent around him

1817
01:12:42,470 --> 01:12:40,560
in writing the article and researching

1818
01:12:45,590 --> 01:12:42,480
the article

1819
01:12:47,270 --> 01:12:45,600
i thought well this whole ce5 business

1820
01:12:48,550 --> 01:12:47,280
close encounters of the fifth kind

1821
01:12:50,470 --> 01:12:48,560
initiative

1822
01:12:52,470 --> 01:12:50,480
human initiated contact with the

1823
01:12:53,910 --> 01:12:52,480
visitors

1824
01:12:55,350 --> 01:12:53,920
using uh

1825
01:12:56,149 --> 01:12:55,360
you know the

1826
01:12:59,110 --> 01:12:56,159
the

1827
01:13:01,510 --> 01:12:59,120
three modalities sound light and

1828
01:13:03,590 --> 01:13:01,520
consciousness or mind

1829
01:13:05,590 --> 01:13:03,600
i thought it was fascinating and i still

1830
01:13:07,270 --> 01:13:05,600
think it's fascinating and and i don't

1831
01:13:10,550 --> 01:13:07,280
know that anyone

1832
01:13:12,709 --> 01:13:10,560
in the field has has bested him

1833
01:13:15,830 --> 01:13:12,719
in that realm now i know he's got a lot

1834
01:13:18,709 --> 01:13:15,840
of detractors a lot of people

1835
01:13:20,630 --> 01:13:18,719
feel like he's a con artist

1836
01:13:23,430 --> 01:13:20,640
on the other hand a lot of people think

1837
01:13:25,350 --> 01:13:23,440
things think he walks on water and you

1838
01:13:25,990 --> 01:13:25,360
know the truth is always in the middle

1839
01:13:29,430 --> 01:13:26,000
in

1840
01:13:34,070 --> 01:13:31,830
you know grier also made a big effort to

1841
01:13:35,350 --> 01:13:34,080
do two disclosure

1842
01:13:37,669 --> 01:13:35,360
projects

1843
01:13:40,790 --> 01:13:37,679
the first one in 97

1844
01:13:43,750 --> 01:13:42,550
oh i forget the name of the hotel in

1845
01:13:45,990 --> 01:13:43,760
washington

1846
01:13:48,149 --> 01:13:46,000
where we had about 15 witnesses and then

1847
01:13:50,149 --> 01:13:48,159
of course his more famous

1848
01:13:52,310 --> 01:13:50,159
internationally covered disclosure

1849
01:13:55,350 --> 01:13:52,320
effort at the press club

1850
01:13:58,310 --> 01:13:55,360
in 2000 or 2001

1851
01:14:00,709 --> 01:13:58,320
which i was not involved in but

1852
01:14:03,110 --> 01:14:00,719
i i write about that pretty extensively

1853
01:14:05,590 --> 01:14:03,120
in chapter nine the uh

1854
01:14:07,270 --> 01:14:05,600
the road to disclosure the barriers to

1855
01:14:08,390 --> 01:14:07,280
truth i think that's the name of that

1856
01:14:09,510 --> 01:14:08,400
chapter

1857
01:14:11,990 --> 01:14:09,520
um

1858
01:14:15,750 --> 01:14:12,000
steve grier's a you know he's

1859
01:14:18,470 --> 01:14:15,760
he's a brilliant uh thinker

1860
01:14:21,110 --> 01:14:18,480
but i know uh he speaks with such

1861
01:14:22,630 --> 01:14:21,120
authority that people often mistaken for

1862
01:14:25,510 --> 01:14:22,640
arrogance and

1863
01:14:28,390 --> 01:14:25,520
self-importance and you know

1864
01:14:31,110 --> 01:14:28,400
i i'm not gonna say

1865
01:14:33,830 --> 01:14:31,120
that isn't true i spent a lot of time

1866
01:14:36,070 --> 01:14:33,840
around him i i

1867
01:14:37,669 --> 01:14:36,080
learned quite a bit from him just on the

1868
01:14:39,990 --> 01:14:37,679
consciousness front

1869
01:14:41,510 --> 01:14:40,000
hence the the word consciousness and the

1870
01:14:43,510 --> 01:14:41,520
subtitle

1871
01:14:46,950 --> 01:14:43,520
but you know i saw

1872
01:14:49,189 --> 01:14:46,960
steve in action time and again where he

1873
01:14:51,830 --> 01:14:49,199
either tipped people off or totally

1874
01:14:53,830 --> 01:14:51,840
alienated them or they became totally

1875
01:14:56,149 --> 01:14:53,840
enamored of him and

1876
01:14:58,630 --> 01:14:56,159
and his initiative and

1877
01:15:00,950 --> 01:14:58,640
his organization but

1878
01:15:02,709 --> 01:15:00,960
his credit you know he made three films

1879
01:15:04,550 --> 01:15:02,719
in the last four or five years that are

1880
01:15:06,790 --> 01:15:04,560
pretty damn interesting

1881
01:15:09,430 --> 01:15:06,800
i hadn't talked to the guy in about 25

1882
01:15:11,830 --> 01:15:09,440
years i sent him a book and he called

1883
01:15:14,550 --> 01:15:11,840
and we chatted recently

1884
01:15:15,990 --> 01:15:14,560
the same old steve greer

1885
01:15:17,990 --> 01:15:16,000
but you know the films speak for

1886
01:15:20,470 --> 01:15:18,000
themselves and there's some interesting

1887
01:15:22,950 --> 01:15:20,480
controversial stuff in there that's

1888
01:15:25,030 --> 01:15:22,960
that's pure stephen greer and

1889
01:15:28,470 --> 01:15:25,040
there's some stuff that that bears

1890
01:15:30,149 --> 01:15:28,480
further discussion and exploration

1891
01:15:31,910 --> 01:15:30,159
well uh

1892
01:15:33,830 --> 01:15:31,920
well thank you thank you for that you

1893
01:15:36,310 --> 01:15:33,840
know it's it's uh

1894
01:15:39,430 --> 01:15:36,320
the one thing i have always said when i

1895
01:15:41,830 --> 01:15:39,440
have to or talk about him

1896
01:15:43,110 --> 01:15:41,840
a lot is and i think in the beginning he

1897
01:15:47,270 --> 01:15:43,120
was very

1898
01:15:49,910 --> 01:15:47,280
really meant something

1899
01:15:51,590 --> 01:15:49,920
you know uh you talk about that first

1900
01:15:52,709 --> 01:15:51,600
thing back i can't remember the year it

1901
01:15:58,310 --> 01:15:52,719
was

1902
01:16:01,030 --> 01:15:58,320
i've seen this happen a few times where

1903
01:16:02,630 --> 01:16:01,040
well someone starts out

1904
01:16:04,870 --> 01:16:02,640
with something really fascinating when

1905
01:16:08,630 --> 01:16:04,880
it comes to this topic they have really

1906
01:16:10,550 --> 01:16:08,640
good goals and then uh then some type of

1907
01:16:11,830 --> 01:16:10,560
factor along the way

1908
01:16:13,270 --> 01:16:11,840
may change

1909
01:16:15,189 --> 01:16:13,280
their approach

1910
01:16:16,870 --> 01:16:15,199
and you know i mean i don't know if this

1911
01:16:18,870 --> 01:16:16,880
is true or not

1912
01:16:22,550 --> 01:16:18,880
but i've had two different people tell

1913
01:16:24,630 --> 01:16:22,560
me that he was charging people to take a

1914
01:16:25,750 --> 01:16:24,640
picture with him inside an invisible

1915
01:16:28,950 --> 01:16:25,760
spaceship

1916
01:16:31,189 --> 01:16:28,960
you know and another thing in one of his

1917
01:16:33,350 --> 01:16:31,199
conferences that he had he supposedly

1918
01:16:34,870 --> 01:16:33,360
had locked the door so nobody could get

1919
01:16:37,110 --> 01:16:34,880
out with bodyguards in front of it you

1920
01:16:39,350 --> 01:16:37,120
know things like that well kind of over

1921
01:16:40,870 --> 01:16:39,360
the top that sounds like hearsay to me

1922
01:16:45,590 --> 01:16:40,880
but um

1923
01:16:47,590 --> 01:16:45,600
i never saw that kind of behavior and uh

1924
01:16:49,990 --> 01:16:47,600
you know for anyone that's ever worked

1925
01:16:52,390 --> 01:16:50,000
in the nonprofit world and see seti has

1926
01:16:54,950 --> 01:16:52,400
been a non-profit since the day it was

1927
01:16:58,709 --> 01:16:56,790
that's a hard thing to run you're always

1928
01:17:00,310 --> 01:16:58,719
in fundraising mode you're always

1929
01:17:02,550 --> 01:17:00,320
looking for new

1930
01:17:04,470 --> 01:17:02,560
channels to raise money new ways to

1931
01:17:06,149 --> 01:17:04,480
raise money i mean having your picture

1932
01:17:08,149 --> 01:17:06,159
taken with him and

1933
01:17:09,990 --> 01:17:08,159
being charged for it i don't know i

1934
01:17:11,510 --> 01:17:10,000
think that happens all the time out into

1935
01:17:14,070 --> 01:17:11,520
hollywood and other

1936
01:17:16,870 --> 01:17:14,080
at other non-profits with whenever you

1937
01:17:19,030 --> 01:17:16,880
have a high profile person in the room i

1938
01:17:21,590 --> 01:17:19,040
know it happens at rock concerts in

1939
01:17:25,990 --> 01:17:21,600
those golden circles where you pay

1940
01:17:28,550 --> 01:17:26,000
500 to go backstage and and eat the uh

1941
01:17:30,950 --> 01:17:28,560
eat the orange m m's with the rock stars

1942
01:17:32,950 --> 01:17:30,960
and have your photo taken so

1943
01:17:35,110 --> 01:17:32,960
i you know i think all that stuff's

1944
01:17:37,110 --> 01:17:35,120
petty at the end of the day i'm more

1945
01:17:39,910 --> 01:17:37,120
interested in the thinking behind the

1946
01:17:43,830 --> 01:17:39,920
ce5 initiative and the whole

1947
01:17:48,709 --> 01:17:47,030
yeah um i had told bill uh earlier we're

1948
01:17:50,790 --> 01:17:48,719
going to just kind of take a little jag

1949
01:17:53,350 --> 01:17:50,800
here for a couple of minutes uh if you

1950
01:17:55,270 --> 01:17:53,360
would bear with me martin um

1951
01:17:57,189 --> 01:17:55,280
because i'd like to bring

1952
01:17:59,510 --> 01:17:57,199
bill in to talk about

1953
01:18:01,430 --> 01:17:59,520
this uh release that

1954
01:18:03,030 --> 01:18:01,440
of course i'd rather have john greenwald

1955
01:18:04,070 --> 01:18:03,040
in but uh in short notice that's not

1956
01:18:06,149 --> 01:18:04,080
going to happen

1957
01:18:08,390 --> 01:18:06,159
uh bill uh you looked into this can you

1958
01:18:10,470 --> 01:18:08,400
talk a little bit about this uh document

1959
01:18:12,630 --> 01:18:10,480
that just came out yeah this came out on

1960
01:18:15,110 --> 01:18:12,640
the black vault which uh john greenwald

1961
01:18:16,390 --> 01:18:15,120
does amazing work with the foyer request

1962
01:18:18,070 --> 01:18:16,400
that he puts in

1963
01:18:19,590 --> 01:18:18,080
now if you scroll down a little bit this

1964
01:18:22,229 --> 01:18:19,600
is department of defense

1965
01:18:24,790 --> 01:18:22,239
these are media cards on how they were

1966
01:18:26,790 --> 01:18:24,800
going to deal with the public when at

1967
01:18:30,550 --> 01:18:26,800
certain points in time

1968
01:18:33,430 --> 01:18:30,560
um dealing with the report the uaps

1969
01:18:34,630 --> 01:18:33,440
it's incredible how they had this all

1970
01:18:36,070 --> 01:18:34,640
outlined

1971
01:18:38,310 --> 01:18:36,080
in preparation of when they were going

1972
01:18:41,189 --> 01:18:38,320
to go to the public and address uh

1973
01:18:43,189 --> 01:18:41,199
certain points regarding the uap report

1974
01:18:44,709 --> 01:18:43,199
now if you scroll down martin go all the

1975
01:18:46,390 --> 01:18:44,719
way down to the bottom of this pdf and

1976
01:18:48,630 --> 01:18:46,400
folks this pdf is available at

1977
01:18:51,030 --> 01:18:48,640
blackvault.com

1978
01:18:52,830 --> 01:18:51,040
it's all the last date i'm looking at is

1979
01:18:56,790 --> 01:18:52,840
june 25th

1980
01:18:58,630 --> 01:18:56,800
2021 and it has it briefing card it

1981
01:19:00,550 --> 01:18:58,640
gives you the summary

1982
01:19:01,590 --> 01:19:00,560
in different times you know the timeline

1983
01:19:04,630 --> 01:19:01,600
is different

1984
01:19:06,390 --> 01:19:04,640
uh top line messages talking points

1985
01:19:07,750 --> 01:19:06,400
of how they're going to interact with

1986
01:19:09,350 --> 01:19:07,760
the media

1987
01:19:11,990 --> 01:19:09,360
some of the q and a's

1988
01:19:14,310 --> 01:19:12,000
it's an incredible this to me

1989
01:19:15,430 --> 01:19:14,320
reveals exactly what was going on behind

1990
01:19:17,990 --> 01:19:15,440
the scenes

1991
01:19:20,229 --> 01:19:18,000
because they had that such concern

1992
01:19:22,550 --> 01:19:20,239
when that uap report came on when it

1993
01:19:24,470 --> 01:19:22,560
came out the uap report really didn't

1994
01:19:25,910 --> 01:19:24,480
have much substance i mean we know that

1995
01:19:28,470 --> 01:19:25,920
i think most of us would agree that it

1996
01:19:30,390 --> 01:19:28,480
didn't have but when you look at this

1997
01:19:31,590 --> 01:19:30,400
and how they were going to address uh

1998
01:19:33,830 --> 01:19:31,600
certain points that were going to be

1999
01:19:35,990 --> 01:19:33,840
brought up this tells you tells you how

2000
01:19:37,750 --> 01:19:36,000
concerned they were when uh it was going

2001
01:19:40,229 --> 01:19:37,760
to get out to the public and the media

2002
01:19:41,590 --> 01:19:40,239
was going to be asking questions um and

2003
01:19:44,390 --> 01:19:41,600
they had they even mentioned louis

2004
01:19:46,870 --> 01:19:44,400
alexander in here and his role

2005
01:19:48,390 --> 01:19:46,880
there you i really suggest that folks go

2006
01:19:51,189 --> 01:19:48,400
to the black vault

2007
01:19:53,350 --> 01:19:51,199
website john greenwald and download this

2008
01:19:55,430 --> 01:19:53,360
pdf and just read it for yourselves

2009
01:19:57,750 --> 01:19:55,440
because it's it's extensive you know

2010
01:20:00,709 --> 01:19:57,760
it's i don't know how many pages but

2011
01:20:02,310 --> 01:20:00,719
um it's it's it's extensive like the

2012
01:20:04,070 --> 01:20:02,320
martin are you did you go to the bottom

2013
01:20:06,149 --> 01:20:04,080
has the apartment on any evidence of

2014
01:20:07,990 --> 01:20:06,159
extraterrestrial technology

2015
01:20:09,910 --> 01:20:08,000
um are there classified unclassified

2016
01:20:12,390 --> 01:20:09,920
versions of the report substantially

2017
01:20:14,709 --> 01:20:12,400
different what did the deputy deputy

2018
01:20:15,669 --> 01:20:14,719
deputy secretary replacing the uap task

2019
01:20:17,590 --> 01:20:15,679
force

2020
01:20:19,270 --> 01:20:17,600
it's incredible when you see how they

2021
01:20:22,149 --> 01:20:19,280
had this

2022
01:20:24,229 --> 01:20:22,159
in preparation to deal with these

2023
01:20:26,149 --> 01:20:24,239
questions that were going to be asked of

2024
01:20:28,470 --> 01:20:26,159
them so these are the actual briefing

2025
01:20:31,669 --> 01:20:28,480
cards of the department of defense

2026
01:20:33,910 --> 01:20:31,679
i highly suggest that people

2027
01:20:36,709 --> 01:20:33,920
check this out and as far as what martin

2028
01:20:37,910 --> 01:20:36,719
said i agree well let's be clear martin

2029
01:20:39,430 --> 01:20:37,920
keller

2030
01:20:41,830 --> 01:20:39,440
um

2031
01:20:43,990 --> 01:20:41,840
you know we don't agree that's for sure

2032
01:20:45,270 --> 01:20:44,000
it is about the consciousness of the ce5

2033
01:20:46,629 --> 01:20:45,280
experiences

2034
01:20:48,070 --> 01:20:46,639
there are a lot of people out there that

2035
01:20:50,709 --> 01:20:48,080
claim that they can

2036
01:20:52,390 --> 01:20:50,719
uh to see they can do the ce5 events

2037
01:20:53,990 --> 01:20:52,400
call in call them in

2038
01:20:55,270 --> 01:20:54,000
and i think that everybody as an

2039
01:20:58,950 --> 01:20:55,280
individual has

2040
01:21:01,189 --> 01:20:58,960
their right to choose who they want to

2041
01:21:02,629 --> 01:21:01,199
agree or disagree with that's what makes

2042
01:21:05,110 --> 01:21:02,639
us all individuals

2043
01:21:07,750 --> 01:21:05,120
um maybe do we agree or disagree on some

2044
01:21:09,830 --> 01:21:07,760
of the methods the methodology

2045
01:21:12,310 --> 01:21:09,840
definitely because like i'm subscribed

2046
01:21:15,110 --> 01:21:12,320
to dr stephen grier's thing and when i

2047
01:21:17,110 --> 01:21:15,120
see first what strikes me and martin

2048
01:21:20,390 --> 01:21:17,120
you're right when he did the 2001

2049
01:21:22,870 --> 01:21:20,400
national club uh the disclosure thing

2050
01:21:24,709 --> 01:21:22,880
what what strikes me is first and i'm

2051
01:21:26,070 --> 01:21:24,719
being honest the price

2052
01:21:26,870 --> 01:21:26,080
to attend one of these i think it's for

2053
01:21:29,830 --> 01:21:26,880
a week

2054
01:21:31,110 --> 01:21:29,840
and then there are guidelines

2055
01:21:33,189 --> 01:21:31,120
you must

2056
01:21:35,110 --> 01:21:33,199
follow those guidelines a schedule if

2057
01:21:37,110 --> 01:21:35,120
you don't they can say you're out of

2058
01:21:38,950 --> 01:21:37,120
here

2059
01:21:41,510 --> 01:21:38,960
i don't know if you know that

2060
01:21:43,830 --> 01:21:41,520
when you when you go to participate in

2061
01:21:46,950 --> 01:21:43,840
some of these events that dr gria does

2062
01:21:49,990 --> 01:21:46,960
there is a schedule if you don't meet

2063
01:21:52,149 --> 01:21:50,000
that schedule um as required by them

2064
01:21:54,390 --> 01:21:52,159
they can simply say okay you're out of

2065
01:21:55,750 --> 01:21:54,400
here you're gone

2066
01:21:57,590 --> 01:21:55,760
because i

2067
01:21:59,430 --> 01:21:57,600
i received them i think that's

2068
01:22:01,189 --> 01:21:59,440
understandable i mean there were ground

2069
01:22:03,430 --> 01:22:01,199
rules in place

2070
01:22:05,030 --> 01:22:03,440
early on for anybody that was doing

2071
01:22:07,990 --> 01:22:05,040
night watches

2072
01:22:11,350 --> 01:22:08,000
during the ce5 thing and i mean those

2073
01:22:13,830 --> 01:22:11,360
those ground rules are in place uh

2074
01:22:16,550 --> 01:22:13,840
not only to protect the organization but

2075
01:22:18,470 --> 01:22:16,560
to protect the people participating

2076
01:22:20,790 --> 01:22:18,480
i mean we i've seen

2077
01:22:23,430 --> 01:22:20,800
stuff happen at some of these

2078
01:22:25,350 --> 01:22:23,440
uh events skywatch events in the evening

2079
01:22:28,550 --> 01:22:25,360
you know where you know there was heavy

2080
01:22:31,030 --> 01:22:28,560
petting and maybe sex off in a cornfield

2081
01:22:33,830 --> 01:22:31,040
with participants who were there to to

2082
01:22:36,550 --> 01:22:33,840
to do the ce5 initiative and

2083
01:22:39,110 --> 01:22:36,560
uh i have to go back to our my mexican

2084
01:22:40,550 --> 01:22:39,120
my story said in mexico in the volcano

2085
01:22:42,629 --> 01:22:40,560
zone the uh

2086
01:22:46,070 --> 01:22:42,639
the reporter from cbs showed up the

2087
01:22:48,470 --> 01:22:46,080
second night on you know at our site

2088
01:22:51,189 --> 01:22:48,480
where we had seen a ufo come in

2089
01:22:54,149 --> 01:22:51,199
previously at about 11 o'clock in the

2090
01:22:56,629 --> 01:22:54,159
evening and it interacted with us as we

2091
01:22:59,270 --> 01:22:56,639
signaled back and forth with it this guy

2092
01:23:01,189 --> 01:22:59,280
showed up harold dow showed up

2093
01:23:03,510 --> 01:23:01,199
carrying a can of beer and drinking it

2094
01:23:05,270 --> 01:23:03,520
like you know he's going to some little

2095
01:23:08,390 --> 01:23:05,280
boy scout

2096
01:23:10,229 --> 01:23:08,400
campfire out out in the in the thules in

2097
01:23:13,270 --> 01:23:10,239
the volcano zone

2098
01:23:15,750 --> 01:23:13,280
so i can't get too excited about that i

2099
01:23:18,310 --> 01:23:15,760
know they're expensive but as i said you

2100
01:23:20,790 --> 01:23:18,320
know like getting non-profited

2101
01:23:22,629 --> 01:23:20,800
it has to uh raise money every year and

2102
01:23:25,590 --> 01:23:22,639
this is i'm sure this is one of greer's

2103
01:23:27,750 --> 01:23:25,600
biggest fundraisers as to this document

2104
01:23:29,669 --> 01:23:27,760
this looks pretty fascinating

2105
01:23:31,830 --> 01:23:29,679
but i have to say as someone who's made

2106
01:23:34,790 --> 01:23:31,840
a living in public relations for 30

2107
01:23:37,350 --> 01:23:34,800
years this looks like your standard

2108
01:23:39,830 --> 01:23:37,360
uh background material that you generate

2109
01:23:40,950 --> 01:23:39,840
in advance of any sort of public policy

2110
01:23:42,870 --> 01:23:40,960
event

2111
01:23:45,270 --> 01:23:42,880
or uh

2112
01:23:47,830 --> 01:23:45,280
information that you're that's that's

2113
01:23:49,030 --> 01:23:47,840
coming out attached to a to a news

2114
01:23:52,229 --> 01:23:49,040
release

2115
01:23:54,070 --> 01:23:52,239
in fact uh you know these q and a's are

2116
01:23:56,149 --> 01:23:54,080
are typical of anything you would do to

2117
01:23:57,430 --> 01:23:56,159
prepare a client to go in front of the

2118
01:23:59,189 --> 01:23:57,440
media so

2119
01:24:01,110 --> 01:23:59,199
you know they don't look like a deer in

2120
01:24:03,590 --> 01:24:01,120
the headlights or they're not blindsided

2121
01:24:05,430 --> 01:24:03,600
by any questions

2122
01:24:07,750 --> 01:24:05,440
that they you know won't be able to

2123
01:24:09,990 --> 01:24:07,760
answer and therefore not not be on

2124
01:24:12,790 --> 01:24:10,000
message so i'm going to take a harder

2125
01:24:14,390 --> 01:24:12,800
look at this but thanks for sharing it

2126
01:24:16,790 --> 01:24:14,400
well gentlemen have a great rest of your

2127
01:24:18,149 --> 01:24:16,800
show and i am getting ready to take some

2128
01:24:20,229 --> 01:24:18,159
callers so

2129
01:24:21,990 --> 01:24:20,239
i am going to depart now so call in

2130
01:24:24,149 --> 01:24:22,000
eight five five four seven two five four

2131
01:24:26,070 --> 01:24:24,159
eight three i'll be waiting on this end

2132
01:24:28,229 --> 01:24:26,080
so gentlemen have a great rest of the

2133
01:24:30,470 --> 01:24:28,239
show i'll put that i'll put that number

2134
01:24:32,790 --> 01:24:30,480
up in a minute i just want to read for

2135
01:24:36,310 --> 01:24:32,800
those people that are just listening to

2136
01:24:39,030 --> 01:24:36,320
audio only question 12 on these uh on

2137
01:24:41,030 --> 01:24:39,040
these questions and answers question 12.

2138
01:24:43,590 --> 01:24:41,040
why now why did the department establish

2139
01:24:44,470 --> 01:24:43,600
the task force why did you announce it

2140
01:24:46,550 --> 01:24:44,480
now

2141
01:24:48,470 --> 01:24:46,560
the answer to 12 the task force was

2142
01:24:50,470 --> 01:24:48,480
established to meet congressional

2143
01:24:53,110 --> 01:24:50,480
guidance including the report directed

2144
01:24:55,189 --> 01:24:53,120
by senate select committee intelligence

2145
01:24:57,189 --> 01:24:55,199
over the last year the dod undertook

2146
01:25:00,629 --> 01:24:57,199
efforts to formalize the good work done

2147
01:25:04,149 --> 01:25:00,639
by the navy for dod in leading

2148
01:25:06,709 --> 01:25:04,159
assessments of uap incursions into dod

2149
01:25:09,350 --> 01:25:06,719
training rangers and designated airspace

2150
01:25:11,669 --> 01:25:09,360
deputy secretary norquist approved the

2151
01:25:15,189 --> 01:25:11,679
established establishment of the

2152
01:25:16,470 --> 01:25:15,199
uap task force on august 4th 2020 but

2153
01:25:18,709 --> 01:25:16,480
you go through all these questions

2154
01:25:20,870 --> 01:25:18,719
there's 12 here there's some on another

2155
01:25:22,390 --> 01:25:20,880
page but anyway it's fascinating check

2156
01:25:24,550 --> 01:25:22,400
it out that uh

2157
01:25:26,709 --> 01:25:24,560
i don't think i can i can't really link

2158
01:25:28,390 --> 01:25:26,719
that particular i should be able to link

2159
01:25:29,750 --> 01:25:28,400
it somehow to john

2160
01:25:31,350 --> 01:25:29,760
greenwald's

2161
01:25:33,990 --> 01:25:31,360
uh

2162
01:25:36,070 --> 01:25:34,000
page but we we have actually we do have

2163
01:25:38,390 --> 01:25:36,080
i'm going to bring bill back in here

2164
01:25:40,470 --> 01:25:38,400
because we actually do have

2165
01:25:41,910 --> 01:25:40,480
someone calling already even though i

2166
01:25:43,750 --> 01:25:41,920
don't have the number up there joanie

2167
01:25:45,189 --> 01:25:43,760
from pennsylvania welcome to the show

2168
01:25:46,310 --> 01:25:45,199
you're live

2169
01:25:47,110 --> 01:25:46,320
all right

2170
01:25:49,270 --> 01:25:47,120
hi

2171
01:25:51,750 --> 01:25:49,280
all right i'd like to know what your

2172
01:25:54,149 --> 01:25:51,760
guest thinks about

2173
01:25:58,550 --> 01:25:54,159
about stan gordon and the textbook

2174
01:26:03,110 --> 01:26:00,550
i'm familiar with

2175
01:26:05,830 --> 01:26:03,120
the kecksburg thing mostly because of

2176
01:26:09,750 --> 01:26:05,840
the reporting that leslie kane did on it

2177
01:26:12,229 --> 01:26:09,760
many years ago uh i'm not that familiar

2178
01:26:14,470 --> 01:26:12,239
what's what's the guy's name stan gordon

2179
01:26:17,430 --> 01:26:14,480
stan gordon's a researcher

2180
01:26:19,110 --> 01:26:17,440
okay yeah i don't know much about stan

2181
01:26:21,669 --> 01:26:19,120
in fact this might be the first time

2182
01:26:22,790 --> 01:26:21,679
i've heard his name but uh i am familiar

2183
01:26:27,910 --> 01:26:22,800
with that

2184
01:26:30,310 --> 01:26:27,920
i can i can add a little bit stan's been

2185
01:26:32,709 --> 01:26:30,320
on this show probably four or five times

2186
01:26:34,790 --> 01:26:32,719
a really nice gentleman i really enjoy

2187
01:26:37,270 --> 01:26:34,800
him he doesn't i don't think he has a

2188
01:26:39,830 --> 01:26:37,280
computer he still is on the on the on

2189
01:26:43,110 --> 01:26:39,840
the landline phone every time i have him

2190
01:26:45,270 --> 01:26:43,120
on but um he has looked deeply into this

2191
01:26:48,390 --> 01:26:45,280
i actually had him debating

2192
01:26:52,149 --> 01:26:48,400
of someone that was trying to consider

2193
01:26:54,950 --> 01:26:52,159
that a a dropped satellite of some

2194
01:26:55,750 --> 01:26:54,960
sort i believe uh

2195
01:27:01,189 --> 01:26:55,760
uh

2196
01:27:04,550 --> 01:27:01,199
i i don't really know there's there's

2197
01:27:07,350 --> 01:27:04,560
kind of funny rumors about a being and i

2198
01:27:09,430 --> 01:27:07,360
don't know how much validity validity

2199
01:27:11,590 --> 01:27:09,440
there is to any of that but you know the

2200
01:27:13,990 --> 01:27:11,600
case itself was pretty amazing you know

2201
01:27:15,910 --> 01:27:14,000
the military did get involved but maybe

2202
01:27:17,510 --> 01:27:15,920
they got involved for

2203
01:27:20,229 --> 01:27:17,520
you know national security reasons that

2204
01:27:21,830 --> 01:27:20,239
had to do with something dangerous on

2205
01:27:23,830 --> 01:27:21,840
something that dropped that wasn't

2206
01:27:25,510 --> 01:27:23,840
supposed to the one thing about that

2207
01:27:27,590 --> 01:27:25,520
whole story is

2208
01:27:30,470 --> 01:27:27,600
this thing changed directions

2209
01:27:31,110 --> 01:27:30,480
before it like crashed and um i don't

2210
01:27:34,390 --> 01:27:31,120
know

2211
01:27:35,910 --> 01:27:34,400
that we'd put up there that would

2212
01:27:38,390 --> 01:27:35,920
actually do that

2213
01:27:40,870 --> 01:27:38,400
uh but unless it was something you know

2214
01:27:42,470 --> 01:27:40,880
misfiring or or whatever it is

2215
01:27:44,709 --> 01:27:42,480
that happened but anything else you'd

2216
01:27:46,790 --> 01:27:44,719
like to ask our guest joni

2217
01:27:49,270 --> 01:27:46,800
yes i'd like to also know what does he

2218
01:27:51,750 --> 01:27:49,280
think about the press the pendulum in

2219
01:27:56,550 --> 01:27:51,760
incident

2220
01:27:59,430 --> 01:27:57,510
uh

2221
01:28:02,709 --> 01:27:59,440
i'm could you could you say that one

2222
01:28:07,110 --> 01:28:05,270
pandersome

2223
01:28:10,229 --> 01:28:07,120
okay

2224
01:28:11,110 --> 01:28:10,239
it's in england in england yeah oh oh

2225
01:28:13,669 --> 01:28:11,120
okay

2226
01:28:15,270 --> 01:28:13,679
um you know i've read quite a bit about

2227
01:28:18,629 --> 01:28:15,280
that

2228
01:28:22,149 --> 01:28:18,639
it seems like a real incident the

2229
01:28:23,830 --> 01:28:22,159
officers involved on that who who have

2230
01:28:25,830 --> 01:28:23,840
come forward over the years have some

2231
01:28:29,750 --> 01:28:25,840
pretty amazing stories especially the

2232
01:28:31,750 --> 01:28:29,760
one individual who claims he received a

2233
01:28:34,390 --> 01:28:31,760
download after he

2234
01:28:38,070 --> 01:28:34,400
put his hands out toward the craft jane

2235
01:28:40,709 --> 01:28:38,080
peniston yeah pennison thank you

2236
01:28:42,790 --> 01:28:40,719
thank you martin

2237
01:28:43,669 --> 01:28:42,800
that's a fascinating case and again you

2238
01:28:44,870 --> 01:28:43,679
know

2239
01:28:46,149 --> 01:28:44,880
uh

2240
01:28:48,870 --> 01:28:46,159
that part of

2241
01:28:51,830 --> 01:28:48,880
of uh of england

2242
01:28:54,070 --> 01:28:51,840
is notorious for having a huge atomic

2243
01:28:56,950 --> 01:28:54,080
stockpile so there might have been some

2244
01:28:59,910 --> 01:28:56,960
surveillance aspect going on with that

2245
01:29:01,990 --> 01:28:59,920
incident uh it's certainly

2246
01:29:03,750 --> 01:29:02,000
you know the brits certainly and the

2247
01:29:05,590 --> 01:29:03,760
americans certainly went to great

2248
01:29:07,669 --> 01:29:05,600
lengths and provided some really

2249
01:29:09,270 --> 01:29:07,679
outrageous stories

2250
01:29:11,910 --> 01:29:09,280
to just you know

2251
01:29:14,470 --> 01:29:11,920
debunk it and and to try to convince

2252
01:29:16,950 --> 01:29:14,480
people it was not a big deal it was

2253
01:29:19,750 --> 01:29:16,960
it was a lighthouse light that they saw

2254
01:29:21,350 --> 01:29:19,760
and it was obscured by the trees and the

2255
01:29:24,149 --> 01:29:21,360
forest and

2256
01:29:27,510 --> 01:29:24,159
it is all kinds of nonsense but pretty

2257
01:29:30,390 --> 01:29:27,520
transparent effort to cover it up

2258
01:29:32,550 --> 01:29:30,400
yeah that was to me that was one of the

2259
01:29:33,990 --> 01:29:32,560
major cases it's in what i consider at

2260
01:29:36,629 --> 01:29:34,000
least the top ten

2261
01:29:38,470 --> 01:29:36,639
of all the cases military was involved

2262
01:29:40,470 --> 01:29:38,480
beam came down on was probably the

2263
01:29:43,030 --> 01:29:40,480
weapon storage area where there may have

2264
01:29:46,229 --> 01:29:43,040
been may or may not been have been nukes

2265
01:29:48,070 --> 01:29:46,239
in there most likely was but um

2266
01:29:50,470 --> 01:29:48,080
colonel charles halt

2267
01:29:52,310 --> 01:29:50,480
commander charles hall would not um

2268
01:29:53,510 --> 01:29:52,320
verify that he does not like being asked

2269
01:29:56,229 --> 01:29:53,520
that question

2270
01:29:58,149 --> 01:29:56,239
so uh but it's all it's all such a

2271
01:30:00,790 --> 01:29:58,159
fascinating case there was a there were

2272
01:30:03,430 --> 01:30:00,800
the people were interrogated afterwards

2273
01:30:05,910 --> 01:30:03,440
and kind of monkeyed with i believe

2274
01:30:07,669 --> 01:30:05,920
and so that's why there's convoluted

2275
01:30:10,390 --> 01:30:07,679
stories about what happened there but a

2276
01:30:12,149 --> 01:30:10,400
fascinating case back in 1980 for those

2277
01:30:14,229 --> 01:30:12,159
new listeners that want to check it out

2278
01:30:18,229 --> 01:30:14,239
the rendelsham forest case thank you

2279
01:30:23,590 --> 01:30:21,510
all right next we have bert he is on the

2280
01:30:26,550 --> 01:30:23,600
line from los angeles bert

2281
01:30:28,790 --> 01:30:26,560
you are live on the air

2282
01:30:31,590 --> 01:30:28,800
uh yes you know i've been uh hearing a

2283
01:30:32,870 --> 01:30:31,600
lot about or after the tic tac videos

2284
01:30:34,870 --> 01:30:32,880
came out

2285
01:30:36,790 --> 01:30:34,880
uh i've heard a lot of reports that the

2286
01:30:39,270 --> 01:30:36,800
military especially the navy has been

2287
01:30:40,870 --> 01:30:39,280
running into these ufos pretty much on a

2288
01:30:44,870 --> 01:30:40,880
daily basis

2289
01:30:46,470 --> 01:30:44,880
and i've also read um reports where um

2290
01:30:48,709 --> 01:30:46,480
back in the roman times you know they

2291
01:30:50,629 --> 01:30:48,719
were seeing these ufos

2292
01:30:52,550 --> 01:30:50,639
so i've come to the conclusion that

2293
01:30:55,270 --> 01:30:52,560
they're not all visiting that you know

2294
01:30:56,870 --> 01:30:55,280
there must be several advanced species

2295
01:30:58,950 --> 01:30:56,880
that live in our oceans and deep earth

2296
01:31:01,030 --> 01:30:58,960
caverns and i think that's the secret

2297
01:31:04,070 --> 01:31:01,040
that the government and the military

2298
01:31:09,189 --> 01:31:06,950
that we're not alone on the planet

2299
01:31:11,110 --> 01:31:09,199
and we never have been

2300
01:31:12,550 --> 01:31:11,120
do you want to comment on that

2301
01:31:13,830 --> 01:31:12,560
well

2302
01:31:16,310 --> 01:31:13,840
yeah that's

2303
01:31:18,070 --> 01:31:16,320
those submersible sightings are pretty

2304
01:31:20,709 --> 01:31:18,080
fascinating and that you know i've read

2305
01:31:22,310 --> 01:31:20,719
a fair amount of the literature about

2306
01:31:24,709 --> 01:31:22,320
bases

2307
01:31:26,310 --> 01:31:24,719
deep in the mariana trenches or where

2308
01:31:29,430 --> 01:31:26,320
you know wherever

2309
01:31:31,990 --> 01:31:29,440
in the oceans and quite a few sightings

2310
01:31:34,390 --> 01:31:32,000
seen around the world of objects

2311
01:31:36,310 --> 01:31:34,400
entering the water and coming out of the

2312
01:31:38,470 --> 01:31:36,320
water at high speeds

2313
01:31:41,350 --> 01:31:38,480
it's quite possible that

2314
01:31:43,830 --> 01:31:41,360
there could be another civilization

2315
01:31:46,470 --> 01:31:43,840
hiding in plain sight but it's also

2316
01:31:48,030 --> 01:31:46,480
quite possible that there are bases

2317
01:31:49,830 --> 01:31:48,040
established by

2318
01:31:51,750 --> 01:31:49,840
space-faring

2319
01:31:54,870 --> 01:31:51,760
civilizations that have

2320
01:31:57,189 --> 01:31:54,880
long ago figured out ways to get here

2321
01:31:59,510 --> 01:31:57,199
in my book i talk about the

2322
01:32:02,070 --> 01:31:59,520
rand report that was written in the in

2323
01:32:03,590 --> 01:32:02,080
the late 60s it was never peer reviewed

2324
01:32:05,990 --> 01:32:03,600
and it was kept

2325
01:32:08,390 --> 01:32:06,000
it was held close by rand and for those

2326
01:32:11,350 --> 01:32:08,400
not familiar rand is a

2327
01:32:12,550 --> 01:32:11,360
rand corporation is a

2328
01:32:14,790 --> 01:32:12,560
long longtime

2329
01:32:17,590 --> 01:32:14,800
conservative think tank kind of on the

2330
01:32:20,550 --> 01:32:17,600
tucker carlson side of the world and

2331
01:32:22,870 --> 01:32:20,560
and uh eventually after years of

2332
01:32:25,510 --> 01:32:22,880
pressure from the ufo community they

2333
01:32:26,550 --> 01:32:25,520
finally released it in the early 90s i

2334
01:32:28,790 --> 01:32:26,560
believe

2335
01:32:31,430 --> 01:32:28,800
and i quote that report fairly

2336
01:32:33,430 --> 01:32:31,440
extensively and

2337
01:32:35,430 --> 01:32:33,440
some of the things the report

2338
01:32:36,310 --> 01:32:35,440
relays is that

2339
01:32:39,030 --> 01:32:36,320
there's

2340
01:32:41,030 --> 01:32:39,040
the possibility of probably

2341
01:32:44,390 --> 01:32:41,040
15 i think i think their number at the

2342
01:32:46,550 --> 01:32:44,400
time was 1500 advanced civilizations

2343
01:32:49,830 --> 01:32:46,560
scattered just throughout

2344
01:32:51,430 --> 01:32:49,840
the milky way galaxy and they actually

2345
01:32:53,830 --> 01:32:51,440
get into

2346
01:32:55,990 --> 01:32:53,840
the incursions at different atomic sites

2347
01:32:57,750 --> 01:32:56,000
since the dawn of the atomic age in the

2348
01:33:01,189 --> 01:32:57,760
40s

2349
01:33:03,830 --> 01:33:01,199
it's a fascinating report and it's been

2350
01:33:05,030 --> 01:33:03,840
corroborated i think in large part

2351
01:33:07,350 --> 01:33:05,040
through

2352
01:33:09,510 --> 01:33:07,360
other research that individual ufo

2353
01:33:11,910 --> 01:33:09,520
researchers have done and that are you

2354
01:33:15,110 --> 01:33:11,920
know is readily available in different

2355
01:33:18,550 --> 01:33:16,470
i think

2356
01:33:21,189 --> 01:33:18,560
you know you can probably find that

2357
01:33:24,310 --> 01:33:21,199
document online too i i think i even had

2358
01:33:27,110 --> 01:33:24,320
an interview with somebody who from rand

2359
01:33:29,830 --> 01:33:27,120
who was uh on their pr desk at the time

2360
01:33:31,430 --> 01:33:29,840
it was released

2361
01:33:36,390 --> 01:33:31,440
well you know my people have also

2362
01:33:40,470 --> 01:33:38,550
say that again bert

2363
01:33:41,910 --> 01:33:40,480
i said uh robert bigelow in his

2364
01:33:44,709 --> 01:33:41,920
interview he has said that you know

2365
01:33:47,270 --> 01:33:44,719
they're right under our noses

2366
01:33:50,550 --> 01:33:47,280
yeah that's a that was a classic bigelow

2367
01:33:53,510 --> 01:33:50,560
moment on uh 60 minutes when when he

2368
01:33:55,830 --> 01:33:53,520
said there's a ufo presence on earth and

2369
01:33:57,750 --> 01:33:55,840
and the reporter i think was pretty

2370
01:33:58,550 --> 01:33:57,760
shocked to

2371
01:34:01,030 --> 01:33:58,560
uh

2372
01:34:03,110 --> 01:34:01,040
have had him say that on camera and he's

2373
01:34:05,189 --> 01:34:03,120
and she says what it what if no one

2374
01:34:06,870 --> 01:34:05,199
believes you and he said he just point

2375
01:34:07,910 --> 01:34:06,880
blank looked at her and he said i don't

2376
01:34:10,790 --> 01:34:07,920
care

2377
01:34:14,550 --> 01:34:10,800
yeah bob bigelow's all about business

2378
01:34:18,390 --> 01:34:14,560
and always has been i tried to get a uh

2379
01:34:20,629 --> 01:34:18,400
a pr uh freelance gig with with nids

2380
01:34:22,550 --> 01:34:20,639
which he ran for a time

2381
01:34:25,110 --> 01:34:22,560
in the

2382
01:34:27,189 --> 01:34:25,120
early 2000s national institute for

2383
01:34:29,430 --> 01:34:27,199
discovery sciences there's

2384
01:34:31,189 --> 01:34:29,440
kind of an amusing story there that's in

2385
01:34:33,669 --> 01:34:31,199
the book

2386
01:34:35,830 --> 01:34:33,679
but you know bob bigelow obviously got

2387
01:34:39,750 --> 01:34:35,840
the big contract from

2388
01:34:42,709 --> 01:34:39,760
from the government to investigate uh

2389
01:34:45,990 --> 01:34:42,719
all the information that

2390
01:34:47,030 --> 01:34:46,000
that was inside the military and he also

2391
01:34:49,590 --> 01:34:47,040
apparently

2392
01:34:51,910 --> 01:34:49,600
even had uh hardware

2393
01:34:54,390 --> 01:34:51,920
that that's being researched or has been

2394
01:34:57,590 --> 01:34:54,400
researched i mean that program

2395
01:34:59,669 --> 01:34:57,600
was set up in 2012 and wasn't revealed

2396
01:35:00,470 --> 01:34:59,679
until 2017

2397
01:35:02,790 --> 01:35:00,480
so

2398
01:35:05,030 --> 01:35:02,800
there's a lot we don't know about that

2399
01:35:07,830 --> 01:35:05,040
whole um

2400
01:35:09,669 --> 01:35:07,840
bigelow investigation

2401
01:35:11,910 --> 01:35:09,679
harry reid in fact told new york

2402
01:35:14,550 --> 01:35:11,920
magazine like that you know i don't know

2403
01:35:17,590 --> 01:35:14,560
what's wrong with the media we have

2404
01:35:20,470 --> 01:35:17,600
eighty percent of this uh

2405
01:35:24,470 --> 01:35:20,480
written report that that we

2406
01:35:26,310 --> 01:35:24,480
that bigelow's researchers generated

2407
01:35:29,590 --> 01:35:26,320
it's available and nobody's come out

2408
01:35:31,270 --> 01:35:29,600
here to look at it and

2409
01:35:32,550 --> 01:35:31,280
you know that's the kind of puzzling

2410
01:35:34,550 --> 01:35:32,560
thing that

2411
01:35:36,790 --> 01:35:34,560
you think well why didn't the new york

2412
01:35:39,030 --> 01:35:36,800
times follow up and actually really get

2413
01:35:41,189 --> 01:35:39,040
into the guts of this thing

2414
01:35:43,990 --> 01:35:41,199
why didn't they look at the hardware

2415
01:35:47,109 --> 01:35:44,000
providing bigelow would have uh allowed

2416
01:35:49,109 --> 01:35:47,119
access etc etc so

2417
01:35:51,430 --> 01:35:49,119
it's a you know it's it's a

2418
01:35:52,629 --> 01:35:51,440
fascinating area and it's a frustrating

2419
01:35:53,990 --> 01:35:52,639
area

2420
01:35:56,870 --> 01:35:54,000
and that's that's kind of my

2421
01:35:58,390 --> 01:35:56,880
organization

2422
01:36:00,310 --> 01:35:58,400
what's that

2423
01:36:01,990 --> 01:36:00,320
i said the job of the mainstream media

2424
01:36:05,270 --> 01:36:02,000
to make sure we don't know the truth

2425
01:36:07,430 --> 01:36:05,280
it's all about distraction with them

2426
01:36:09,430 --> 01:36:07,440
well i think it's all about selling cars

2427
01:36:12,470 --> 01:36:09,440
and facial cream and

2428
01:36:13,590 --> 01:36:12,480
it's all about you know the bottom line

2429
01:36:15,109 --> 01:36:13,600
i forget

2430
01:36:17,109 --> 01:36:15,119
i need to have a chart in front of me

2431
01:36:19,910 --> 01:36:17,119
when i do these interviews because i

2432
01:36:22,629 --> 01:36:19,920
forget the number of corporations that

2433
01:36:24,470 --> 01:36:22,639
that own uh you know the major networks

2434
01:36:27,189 --> 01:36:24,480
now and

2435
01:36:29,270 --> 01:36:27,199
it's it's pretty disturbing

2436
01:36:31,669 --> 01:36:29,280
well we used to have a time where

2437
01:36:35,109 --> 01:36:31,679
you know there was like four channels on

2438
01:36:37,030 --> 01:36:35,119
tv and you know news came on for an hour

2439
01:36:38,390 --> 01:36:37,040
at seven and now you know cable has to

2440
01:36:41,430 --> 01:36:38,400
fill the time

2441
01:36:44,790 --> 01:36:41,440
uh you know with with news and

2442
01:36:45,990 --> 01:36:44,800
uh you know so i don't know uh

2443
01:36:48,070 --> 01:36:46,000
uh

2444
01:36:53,030 --> 01:36:48,080
there's a lot of

2445
01:36:56,470 --> 01:36:53,040
there compared to facts is what i'm

2446
01:37:00,070 --> 01:36:56,480
getting uh getting at uh and also bert

2447
01:37:02,950 --> 01:37:00,080
just uh you mentioned the possibility of

2448
01:37:06,070 --> 01:37:02,960
them being you know planet bound uh you

2449
01:37:07,910 --> 01:37:06,080
know the earth is 70 ocean and we know

2450
01:37:10,070 --> 01:37:07,920
more about the moon surface than we do

2451
01:37:12,629 --> 01:37:10,080
about the ocean floor

2452
01:37:14,709 --> 01:37:12,639
i i have an open mind you know there are

2453
01:37:17,030 --> 01:37:14,719
people that have seen you know a friend

2454
01:37:17,990 --> 01:37:17,040
of mine mark d'antonio saw something

2455
01:37:20,550 --> 01:37:18,000
going

2456
01:37:23,510 --> 01:37:20,560
you know over 200 knots when he was out

2457
01:37:25,830 --> 01:37:23,520
on a test in a submarine uh years ago

2458
01:37:27,510 --> 01:37:25,840
and they said oh yeah that's a fast fast

2459
01:37:28,229 --> 01:37:27,520
walk or a fast mover or something like

2460
01:37:32,470 --> 01:37:28,239
that

2461
01:37:35,990 --> 01:37:34,470
it makes more sense if you start with

2462
01:37:38,470 --> 01:37:36,000
that premise that they're from this

2463
01:37:39,430 --> 01:37:38,480
planet as opposed to visiting

2464
01:37:40,310 --> 01:37:39,440
yeah

2465
01:37:43,270 --> 01:37:40,320
and then

2466
01:37:45,750 --> 01:37:43,280
but if so i mean what kind i think of

2467
01:37:47,030 --> 01:37:45,760
these things like what kind of life

2468
01:37:49,910 --> 01:37:47,040
could

2469
01:37:51,350 --> 01:37:49,920
whatever it is have under the ocean or

2470
01:37:52,870 --> 01:37:51,360
you know some people say they're in the

2471
01:37:53,990 --> 01:37:52,880
planet you know on underground or

2472
01:37:56,070 --> 01:37:54,000
whatever

2473
01:37:57,270 --> 01:37:56,080
but what type of life would anything

2474
01:37:59,270 --> 01:37:57,280
have

2475
01:38:01,590 --> 01:37:59,280
in just uh

2476
01:38:02,709 --> 01:38:01,600
you know the elements of of water you

2477
01:38:04,550 --> 01:38:02,719
know

2478
01:38:06,550 --> 01:38:04,560
don't think like a human try to think

2479
01:38:08,070 --> 01:38:06,560
like a civilization that has existed for

2480
01:38:08,870 --> 01:38:08,080
thousands of years

2481
01:38:14,070 --> 01:38:08,880
yeah

2482
01:38:16,550 --> 01:38:14,080
hey bert thank you anything else i think

2483
01:38:18,870 --> 01:38:16,560
that's where we get trip very much

2484
01:38:20,550 --> 01:38:18,880
bird i think that's where we we humans

2485
01:38:22,870 --> 01:38:20,560
get tripped up a lot we're very

2486
01:38:24,870 --> 01:38:22,880
anthropocentric we

2487
01:38:27,189 --> 01:38:24,880
tend to do it everything

2488
01:38:29,990 --> 01:38:27,199
through the lens of the human

2489
01:38:32,950 --> 01:38:30,000
mind such as it is and the thing that

2490
01:38:36,310 --> 01:38:32,960
intrigued me initially about steve greer

2491
01:38:38,629 --> 01:38:36,320
was that he he often held a uf uh

2492
01:38:40,390 --> 01:38:38,639
perspective an et perspective that i

2493
01:38:42,709 --> 01:38:40,400
hadn't heard anywhere else

2494
01:38:44,790 --> 01:38:42,719
among researchers and i thought

2495
01:38:47,990 --> 01:38:44,800
early on before i went to work as his

2496
01:38:49,590 --> 01:38:48,000
publicist in the 90s early on

2497
01:38:53,189 --> 01:38:49,600
i thought well this this could be the

2498
01:38:57,270 --> 01:38:53,199
next level of ufology and uh i think to

2499
01:38:58,390 --> 01:38:57,280
date that's withstood the test of time

2500
01:39:00,470 --> 01:38:58,400
thanks for the call

2501
01:39:02,550 --> 01:39:00,480
um the line is open and again that

2502
01:39:04,950 --> 01:39:02,560
number is eight five five four seven two

2503
01:39:07,109 --> 01:39:04,960
five four eight three i'll call in for

2504
01:39:09,270 --> 01:39:07,119
your questions also if you're going to

2505
01:39:11,430 --> 01:39:09,280
uh you don't feel like calling in and

2506
01:39:14,070 --> 01:39:11,440
you'd rather post a question on chat

2507
01:39:16,790 --> 01:39:14,080
just please do put that in caps so i i

2508
01:39:18,709 --> 01:39:16,800
do i do not miss it um

2509
01:39:21,109 --> 01:39:18,719
let me ask you in your

2510
01:39:21,990 --> 01:39:21,119
the topic of you probably saw during the

2511
01:39:24,070 --> 01:39:22,000
break

2512
01:39:25,990 --> 01:39:24,080
i asked you know like

2513
01:39:27,830 --> 01:39:26,000
other abductions are there people that

2514
01:39:30,229 --> 01:39:27,840
claim they see beings and

2515
01:39:32,550 --> 01:39:30,239
that part is that like

2516
01:39:34,629 --> 01:39:32,560
in your book at all or is that

2517
01:39:36,790 --> 01:39:34,639
too far out there for

2518
01:39:39,430 --> 01:39:36,800
for you to to go

2519
01:39:41,590 --> 01:39:39,440
no in fact uh chapter three is

2520
01:39:46,229 --> 01:39:41,600
completely dedicated to the so-called

2521
01:39:52,550 --> 01:39:48,870
kind of bouncing off my experience of

2522
01:39:54,790 --> 01:39:52,560
the five little red orbs in the room

2523
01:39:57,750 --> 01:39:54,800
because i had some side effects from

2524
01:39:59,669 --> 01:39:57,760
that event that lasted two or three days

2525
01:40:00,950 --> 01:39:59,679
physical and mental

2526
01:40:03,669 --> 01:40:00,960
and uh

2527
01:40:05,990 --> 01:40:03,679
it was disturbing like i said earlier i

2528
01:40:07,270 --> 01:40:06,000
went searching for answers and

2529
01:40:10,550 --> 01:40:07,280
um

2530
01:40:13,590 --> 01:40:10,560
a sea city member from california uh

2531
01:40:16,550 --> 01:40:13,600
in that same period sent me a uh

2532
01:40:18,070 --> 01:40:16,560
a monogram by a guy a guy named martin

2533
01:40:22,149 --> 01:40:18,080
cannon

2534
01:40:25,590 --> 01:40:22,159
who talks about the ability of

2535
01:40:28,070 --> 01:40:25,600
abductions to be staged

2536
01:40:31,910 --> 01:40:28,080
through human means through technologies

2537
01:40:33,990 --> 01:40:31,920
etc it's a fascinating 60-some page

2538
01:40:36,390 --> 01:40:34,000
document

2539
01:40:38,870 --> 01:40:36,400
that i quote pretty extensively from and

2540
01:40:41,590 --> 01:40:38,880
there's been subsequent books written on

2541
01:40:44,870 --> 01:40:41,600
it by uh

2542
01:40:48,229 --> 01:40:44,880
about military abductions uh i'm

2543
01:40:51,350 --> 01:40:48,239
blanking on the guy's name

2544
01:40:53,590 --> 01:40:51,360
lambert lambert uh

2545
01:40:55,990 --> 01:40:53,600
it'll come to me in a second so

2546
01:40:58,790 --> 01:40:56,000
i delved pretty deeply into this into

2547
01:41:01,350 --> 01:40:58,800
this martin cannon work

2548
01:41:03,669 --> 01:41:01,360
which is interesting because it it makes

2549
01:41:06,229 --> 01:41:03,679
a very strong case that you can

2550
01:41:08,470 --> 01:41:06,239
manufacture an abduction and an

2551
01:41:11,270 --> 01:41:08,480
abduction experience

2552
01:41:13,510 --> 01:41:11,280
using these technological tools these

2553
01:41:14,870 --> 01:41:13,520
psychotronic weapons

2554
01:41:17,030 --> 01:41:14,880
which are

2555
01:41:19,350 --> 01:41:17,040
initially came out of the mkultra

2556
01:41:21,750 --> 01:41:19,360
program and i think probably some of

2557
01:41:23,910 --> 01:41:21,760
your listeners in martin you might be

2558
01:41:27,750 --> 01:41:23,920
familiar with that because the congress

2559
01:41:30,470 --> 01:41:27,760
busted the the cia back in the late 70s

2560
01:41:33,270 --> 01:41:30,480
when it was exposed that they had been

2561
01:41:34,550 --> 01:41:33,280
conducting drug experiments on military

2562
01:41:37,310 --> 01:41:34,560
men and women

2563
01:41:39,109 --> 01:41:37,320
using lsd and other uh other

2564
01:41:42,149 --> 01:41:39,119
hallucinogens

2565
01:41:44,629 --> 01:41:42,159
mostly for behavior modification but you

2566
01:41:47,109 --> 01:41:44,639
know the disability and manufacturing

2567
01:41:49,510 --> 01:41:47,119
abduction experience came out of that

2568
01:41:50,550 --> 01:41:49,520
same mindset and maybe even that same

2569
01:41:53,350 --> 01:41:50,560
program

2570
01:41:54,550 --> 01:41:53,360
cannon time and again in his research

2571
01:41:56,790 --> 01:41:54,560
says this

2572
01:41:59,189 --> 01:41:56,800
needs to be looked into more thoroughly

2573
01:42:01,910 --> 01:41:59,199
and this whole abduction thing needs

2574
01:42:06,229 --> 01:42:01,920
needs to be put to bed uh we need to

2575
01:42:10,310 --> 01:42:08,229
the interesting thing about

2576
01:42:13,430 --> 01:42:10,320
cannon's work which he subsequently

2577
01:42:16,070 --> 01:42:13,440
turned into a book 300 page book which

2578
01:42:19,109 --> 01:42:16,080
is now also out of print

2579
01:42:20,390 --> 01:42:19,119
is that at some point canon disavowed

2580
01:42:21,430 --> 01:42:20,400
his whole

2581
01:42:23,510 --> 01:42:21,440
theory

2582
01:42:26,629 --> 01:42:23,520
that he had presented in the book and in

2583
01:42:28,629 --> 01:42:26,639
the 60 page monogram saying that this

2584
01:42:30,550 --> 01:42:28,639
damn thing has got me in more trouble

2585
01:42:31,830 --> 01:42:30,560
than i ever imagined which to me just

2586
01:42:34,310 --> 01:42:31,840
says hey you

2587
01:42:35,270 --> 01:42:34,320
you touch some very raw nerves there pal

2588
01:42:37,590 --> 01:42:35,280
and and

2589
01:42:38,790 --> 01:42:37,600
you protest too much this is probably

2590
01:42:41,270 --> 01:42:38,800
all very

2591
01:42:43,430 --> 01:42:41,280
factual and reliable research that

2592
01:42:46,390 --> 01:42:43,440
you've created in this

2593
01:42:48,950 --> 01:42:46,400
yet another fascinating sort of blind

2594
01:42:51,910 --> 01:42:48,960
alley that ufology

2595
01:42:56,550 --> 01:42:53,910
it it is and you know when i first

2596
01:42:57,350 --> 01:42:56,560
started the show i was i was totally

2597
01:42:59,750 --> 01:42:57,360
like

2598
01:43:02,390 --> 01:42:59,760
on the fence and

2599
01:43:04,709 --> 01:43:02,400
uh i do believe that

2600
01:43:05,990 --> 01:43:04,719
you know something is happening

2601
01:43:09,430 --> 01:43:06,000
i don't know

2602
01:43:11,430 --> 01:43:09,440
exactly what it is and i i think

2603
01:43:13,109 --> 01:43:11,440
you know even though there purportedly

2604
01:43:15,510 --> 01:43:13,119
is so many

2605
01:43:17,990 --> 01:43:15,520
people saying in this country that

2606
01:43:20,070 --> 01:43:18,000
they're having these experiences

2607
01:43:23,590 --> 01:43:20,080
i still think something like this has to

2608
01:43:25,430 --> 01:43:23,600
be done on a case-by-case basis and

2609
01:43:27,910 --> 01:43:25,440
to try to figure out

2610
01:43:30,629 --> 01:43:27,920
you know i mean you know it has the one

2611
01:43:33,590 --> 01:43:30,639
thing about ufos there's there's

2612
01:43:35,510 --> 01:43:33,600
multiple witnesses often times

2613
01:43:37,750 --> 01:43:35,520
in the abduction thing every once in a

2614
01:43:40,390 --> 01:43:37,760
while you'll hear about another witness

2615
01:43:42,470 --> 01:43:40,400
but i have never heard i've never spoke

2616
01:43:44,629 --> 01:43:42,480
to someone that witnessed one

2617
01:43:46,149 --> 01:43:44,639
i've never had anyone like that on the

2618
01:43:48,870 --> 01:43:46,159
show discuss

2619
01:43:51,109 --> 01:43:48,880
actually witnessing one except for you

2620
01:43:53,430 --> 01:43:51,119
know there was the one case

2621
01:43:56,229 --> 01:43:53,440
that's uh i've really covered heavily on

2622
01:43:58,310 --> 01:43:56,239
this the berkshires ufo incident when

2623
01:43:59,270 --> 01:43:58,320
when tom warner like disappeared in a

2624
01:44:02,550 --> 01:43:59,280
beam

2625
01:44:04,790 --> 01:44:02,560
a by witness saw that and then was uh

2626
01:44:07,270 --> 01:44:04,800
placed back down you know i mean

2627
01:44:09,590 --> 01:44:07,280
that's another really bizarre thing but

2628
01:44:12,390 --> 01:44:09,600
uh and the travis walton case i think is

2629
01:44:14,390 --> 01:44:12,400
pretty strong out of arizona yes

2630
01:44:16,709 --> 01:44:14,400
yeah they made a movie out of that fire

2631
01:44:18,790 --> 01:44:16,719
in the sky it's worth watching

2632
01:44:22,790 --> 01:44:18,800
right uh the whole abduction thing is

2633
01:44:28,149 --> 01:44:22,800
very fascinating i think john mack

2634
01:44:32,310 --> 01:44:29,750
looking into the

2635
01:44:35,109 --> 01:44:32,320
the prospect that maybe these weren't

2636
01:44:36,790 --> 01:44:35,119
physical abductions per se

2637
01:44:39,990 --> 01:44:36,800
that they were that

2638
01:44:42,550 --> 01:44:40,000
beings or or some sort of force had

2639
01:44:43,910 --> 01:44:42,560
figured out a way to to hack human

2640
01:44:45,590 --> 01:44:43,920
consciousness

2641
01:44:47,270 --> 01:44:45,600
and these things were taking place

2642
01:44:49,430 --> 01:44:47,280
inside the mind

2643
01:44:51,270 --> 01:44:49,440
rather than inside of a spaceship

2644
01:44:53,350 --> 01:44:51,280
hovering over your house at three in the

2645
01:44:54,709 --> 01:44:53,360
morning

2646
01:44:56,550 --> 01:44:54,719
you know that's

2647
01:44:58,310 --> 01:44:56,560
that's the kind of stuff that gets me

2648
01:45:01,669 --> 01:44:58,320
intellectually

2649
01:45:04,950 --> 01:45:01,679
excited to learn more about this uh of

2650
01:45:07,590 --> 01:45:04,960
course whitley strieber you know he

2651
01:45:09,669 --> 01:45:07,600
he would characterize his experiences i

2652
01:45:12,310 --> 01:45:09,679
think as abductions

2653
01:45:13,910 --> 01:45:12,320
i just saw a quote from him recently

2654
01:45:17,030 --> 01:45:13,920
though saying he doesn't know if they're

2655
01:45:19,910 --> 01:45:17,040
space men or women or beings

2656
01:45:21,510 --> 01:45:19,920
he says that's a that's a big tbd but he

2657
01:45:24,310 --> 01:45:21,520
definitely had

2658
01:45:25,270 --> 01:45:24,320
uh these experiences time and again that

2659
01:45:28,790 --> 01:45:25,280
he

2660
01:45:31,430 --> 01:45:28,800
obviously had written communion about

2661
01:45:33,430 --> 01:45:31,440
and uh

2662
01:45:35,669 --> 01:45:33,440
you know i like i like to think of it

2663
01:45:38,149 --> 01:45:35,679
these days as the close encounters of

2664
01:45:39,830 --> 01:45:38,159
the fourth kind the interaction with

2665
01:45:42,709 --> 01:45:39,840
being spotted

2666
01:45:45,270 --> 01:45:42,719
you know either in or outside of a craft

2667
01:45:48,390 --> 01:45:45,280
those are probably the real deal whereas

2668
01:45:49,270 --> 01:45:48,400
the so-called hardcore abductions that

2669
01:45:51,189 --> 01:45:49,280
we're

2670
01:45:55,750 --> 01:45:51,199
familiar with that the media really

2671
01:45:58,550 --> 01:45:55,760
seized on in the 90s and early 2000s

2672
01:46:00,229 --> 01:45:58,560
those are those are likely manufactured

2673
01:46:02,310 --> 01:46:00,239
events and

2674
01:46:04,629 --> 01:46:02,320
i think

2675
01:46:08,229 --> 01:46:04,639
they happen or they do happen because

2676
01:46:10,790 --> 01:46:08,239
they they want to pollute the

2677
01:46:12,629 --> 01:46:10,800
the real thing they want to uh

2678
01:46:13,430 --> 01:46:12,639
you know it's a it's another way for

2679
01:46:15,990 --> 01:46:13,440
them

2680
01:46:18,070 --> 01:46:16,000
to put people off the the game to put

2681
01:46:19,270 --> 01:46:18,080
them off the research to put the math

2682
01:46:24,709 --> 01:46:19,280
off the

2683
01:46:27,350 --> 01:46:24,719
what stephen bassett calls the the truth

2684
01:46:29,830 --> 01:46:27,360
embargo all these

2685
01:46:36,310 --> 01:46:32,950
all these situations that that may

2686
01:46:39,109 --> 01:46:36,320
extend from the mk ultra program i mean

2687
01:46:40,709 --> 01:46:39,119
it's it's almost more disturbing to

2688
01:46:43,430 --> 01:46:40,719
think that that

2689
01:46:46,070 --> 01:46:43,440
this is a reality that we live with

2690
01:46:47,990 --> 01:46:46,080
versus the reality of extraterrestrial

2691
01:46:50,390 --> 01:46:48,000
visitors i mean i think

2692
01:46:52,149 --> 01:46:50,400
that's more disturbing than anything

2693
01:46:55,750 --> 01:46:52,159
that that

2694
01:46:58,070 --> 01:46:55,760
the military or psyops or black programs

2695
01:46:59,990 --> 01:46:58,080
would have these uh

2696
01:47:02,390 --> 01:47:00,000
abduction

2697
01:47:04,229 --> 01:47:02,400
episodes executed in the name of

2698
01:47:06,229 --> 01:47:04,239
national security or whatever they want

2699
01:47:08,310 --> 01:47:06,239
to call it

2700
01:47:10,149 --> 01:47:08,320
and i you know i explore that pretty

2701
01:47:12,870 --> 01:47:10,159
heavily in the book

2702
01:47:14,629 --> 01:47:12,880
uh-huh uh mary grace is asking this

2703
01:47:16,310 --> 01:47:14,639
question and uh just to let you know

2704
01:47:18,070 --> 01:47:16,320
mary grace the reason i didn't ask the

2705
01:47:20,550 --> 01:47:18,080
one above you

2706
01:47:23,669 --> 01:47:20,560
uh because this happened when he was

2707
01:47:26,310 --> 01:47:23,679
young about the orbs in his home but

2708
01:47:27,510 --> 01:47:26,320
about the latest paranormal things that

2709
01:47:29,750 --> 01:47:27,520
have happened

2710
01:47:31,750 --> 01:47:29,760
uh can you talk at all about those i

2711
01:47:34,390 --> 01:47:31,760
know you said you wanted to put those in

2712
01:47:35,669 --> 01:47:34,400
your next book but can you discuss any

2713
01:47:37,270 --> 01:47:35,679
part of that do you feel comfortable

2714
01:47:39,590 --> 01:47:37,280
talking about it well i don't think

2715
01:47:40,550 --> 01:47:39,600
there'll be a next book but uh you know

2716
01:47:42,629 --> 01:47:40,560
what i'm going to do

2717
01:47:45,430 --> 01:47:42,639
might be on it might be in the blog i'll

2718
01:47:47,510 --> 01:47:45,440
give you one um

2719
01:47:50,229 --> 01:47:47,520
i'll give you one there were there were

2720
01:47:53,350 --> 01:47:50,239
two that were pretty

2721
01:47:57,109 --> 01:47:54,950
trying to decide which

2722
01:48:02,470 --> 01:47:57,119
which one is a shorter story watching

2723
01:48:10,070 --> 01:48:05,350
i'll have to i think i'm gonna

2724
01:48:12,629 --> 01:48:10,080
relate the uh incident in march

2725
01:48:14,550 --> 01:48:12,639
kind of right on the edge of

2726
01:48:16,830 --> 01:48:14,560
the end of winter the beginning of

2727
01:48:20,229 --> 01:48:16,840
spring in minnesota late

2728
01:48:22,950 --> 01:48:20,239
march and i was

2729
01:48:25,830 --> 01:48:22,960
finishing the book or almost finishing

2730
01:48:27,750 --> 01:48:25,840
it i actually was revising this book

2731
01:48:29,030 --> 01:48:27,760
right up until the publication date

2732
01:48:30,229 --> 01:48:29,040
because there was so much new

2733
01:48:32,709 --> 01:48:30,239
information

2734
01:48:35,590 --> 01:48:32,719
coming out in the run-up to this uh

2735
01:48:37,030 --> 01:48:35,600
government report in late june

2736
01:48:39,270 --> 01:48:37,040
but i uh

2737
01:48:41,350 --> 01:48:39,280
had been thinking about a lot of the you

2738
01:48:42,550 --> 01:48:41,360
know the shape of how to end the book

2739
01:48:48,470 --> 01:48:42,560
and

2740
01:48:50,790 --> 01:48:48,480
long time since i i've had any

2741
01:48:54,550 --> 01:48:50,800
high strangeness stuff or

2742
01:48:57,030 --> 01:48:54,560
even a sighting or anything and i i

2743
01:48:59,750 --> 01:48:57,040
ran over to pick up some chinese food at

2744
01:49:02,629 --> 01:48:59,760
a chinese restaurant about a quarter of

2745
01:49:05,910 --> 01:49:02,639
a mile from our house

2746
01:49:07,910 --> 01:49:05,920
and coming back i was on uh for anyone

2747
01:49:10,070 --> 01:49:07,920
that's familiar with the

2748
01:49:13,189 --> 01:49:10,080
the major thoroughfares in in

2749
01:49:16,310 --> 01:49:13,199
minneapolis hiawatha avenue otherwise

2750
01:49:18,870 --> 01:49:16,320
known as highway 55 it runs from

2751
01:49:21,189 --> 01:49:18,880
downtown to the airport and then

2752
01:49:22,310 --> 01:49:21,199
over into st paul

2753
01:49:23,430 --> 01:49:22,320
and on

2754
01:49:25,589 --> 01:49:23,440
south

2755
01:49:28,149 --> 01:49:25,599
anyway i'm at the

2756
01:49:29,510 --> 01:49:28,159
stoplight after having just picked up

2757
01:49:31,910 --> 01:49:29,520
the food

2758
01:49:33,750 --> 01:49:31,920
and i'm at the stoplight waiting for the

2759
01:49:36,070 --> 01:49:33,760
green arrow

2760
01:49:37,189 --> 01:49:36,080
to make a left turn

2761
01:49:38,550 --> 01:49:37,199
and

2762
01:49:41,350 --> 01:49:38,560
in the uh

2763
01:49:43,910 --> 01:49:41,360
the near distances i can see the skyline

2764
01:49:45,990 --> 01:49:43,920
of minneapolis you know we're about

2765
01:49:47,270 --> 01:49:46,000
where i live we're about 10 minutes from

2766
01:49:50,629 --> 01:49:47,280
downtown

2767
01:49:53,510 --> 01:49:50,639
skylines always visible from that road

2768
01:49:56,390 --> 01:49:53,520
and almost it seemed like almost out of

2769
01:49:57,270 --> 01:49:56,400
nowhere i saw

2770
01:50:05,990 --> 01:49:57,280
a

2771
01:50:08,830 --> 01:50:06,000
uh

2772
01:50:13,189 --> 01:50:08,840
my line of vision it seemed to cross

2773
01:50:15,750 --> 01:50:13,199
the hiawatha avenue or highway 55 it it

2774
01:50:17,990 --> 01:50:15,760
was about maybe

2775
01:50:20,870 --> 01:50:18,000
300 feet above the ground and my first

2776
01:50:22,709 --> 01:50:20,880
reaction was to look around at the cars

2777
01:50:25,270 --> 01:50:22,719
surrounding me to see if they had

2778
01:50:27,189 --> 01:50:25,280
noticed this because it was i mean it

2779
01:50:29,189 --> 01:50:27,199
was visible and they were quite that's a

2780
01:50:30,790 --> 01:50:29,199
very high traffic area

2781
01:50:33,109 --> 01:50:30,800
and there were quite a few cars there

2782
01:50:35,910 --> 01:50:33,119
waiting for the light to change and i

2783
01:50:38,950 --> 01:50:35,920
saw this thing move across off

2784
01:50:40,790 --> 01:50:38,960
into the distance i tried to follow it

2785
01:50:42,950 --> 01:50:40,800
as long as i could but then the light

2786
01:50:45,589 --> 01:50:42,960
changed green and i had to turn

2787
01:50:47,750 --> 01:50:45,599
now that's interesting in and of itself

2788
01:50:49,750 --> 01:50:47,760
but especially since i've been thinking

2789
01:50:51,830 --> 01:50:49,760
about not having any

2790
01:50:53,189 --> 01:50:51,840
sightings or anything for for a very

2791
01:50:55,990 --> 01:50:53,199
long time

2792
01:50:59,430 --> 01:50:56,000
but three days later i went over to a

2793
01:51:01,270 --> 01:50:59,440
friend of mine's house curtis a who's

2794
01:51:03,910 --> 01:51:01,280
discussed in the book a couple different

2795
01:51:05,669 --> 01:51:03,920
places he's a legendary

2796
01:51:07,189 --> 01:51:05,679
rock and roll guy here in the twin

2797
01:51:08,790 --> 01:51:07,199
cities

2798
01:51:10,870 --> 01:51:08,800
he's got his own

2799
01:51:13,589 --> 01:51:10,880
what sounds like real abduction story

2800
01:51:16,550 --> 01:51:13,599
that took place in wisconsin

2801
01:51:18,629 --> 01:51:16,560
when he was a young man

2802
01:51:21,430 --> 01:51:18,639
anyway i was going over to kurt's house

2803
01:51:24,229 --> 01:51:21,440
just to visit him in st paul

2804
01:51:28,149 --> 01:51:24,239
and of course kurt has probably more ufo

2805
01:51:30,629 --> 01:51:28,159
books than you and i put together martin

2806
01:51:33,270 --> 01:51:30,639
and he's always got the latest ones

2807
01:51:36,070 --> 01:51:33,280
on his coffee table so i'm sitting there

2808
01:51:39,589 --> 01:51:36,080
chatting with him about something else

2809
01:51:41,910 --> 01:51:39,599
and i noticed a photo book and he goes

2810
01:51:43,990 --> 01:51:41,920
oh yeah that's new so i'm just kind of

2811
01:51:47,030 --> 01:51:44,000
nonchalantly paging through it and all

2812
01:51:49,430 --> 01:51:47,040
of a sudden i open up a page and there's

2813
01:51:52,550 --> 01:51:49,440
an image of the same sort of craft i had

2814
01:51:53,510 --> 01:51:52,560
seen three days earlier over highway 55

2815
01:51:55,589 --> 01:51:53,520
and i

2816
01:51:58,310 --> 01:51:55,599
and then of course i said you see this

2817
01:52:00,550 --> 01:51:58,320
kurt i said i just saw this

2818
01:52:02,470 --> 01:52:00,560
this object three nights ago

2819
01:52:05,189 --> 01:52:02,480
after picking up chinese food and he

2820
01:52:06,229 --> 01:52:05,199
goes yeah man cool

2821
01:52:09,030 --> 01:52:06,239
wow

2822
01:52:11,350 --> 01:52:09,040
so that's one the other one is

2823
01:52:13,510 --> 01:52:11,360
is even stranger and and i'm not even

2824
01:52:14,229 --> 01:52:13,520
sure it's related to et's

2825
01:52:16,390 --> 01:52:14,239
it's

2826
01:52:17,270 --> 01:52:16,400
yeah well we we have actually run out of

2827
01:52:20,070 --> 01:52:17,280
time

2828
01:52:22,310 --> 01:52:20,080
so uh if you would you're you're give

2829
01:52:26,870 --> 01:52:22,320
your website out one more time yeah it's

2830
01:52:31,030 --> 01:52:28,470
there's some good information on what

2831
01:52:33,350 --> 01:52:31,040
the book's about there's my ongoing blog

2832
01:52:35,189 --> 01:52:33,360
there and there's also a couple links

2833
01:52:37,430 --> 01:52:35,199
where you can jump off and order the

2834
01:52:38,470 --> 01:52:37,440
book on amazon and there's also an email

2835
01:52:41,510 --> 01:52:38,480
address

2836
01:52:43,189 --> 01:52:41,520
where you can send me questions or

2837
01:52:45,830 --> 01:52:43,199
stories that you might that you might

2838
01:52:47,750 --> 01:52:45,840
want to share with me and i'll uh

2839
01:52:50,310 --> 01:52:47,760
eventually get around to posting those

2840
01:52:52,149 --> 01:52:50,320
on the blog site excellent thank you so

2841
01:52:53,750 --> 01:52:52,159
much martin it's been thank you martin

2842
01:52:55,669 --> 01:52:53,760
it's been a pleasure

2843
01:52:57,510 --> 01:52:55,679
have a good night thank you again

2844
01:52:59,669 --> 01:52:57,520
all right all right everyone so that's

2845
01:53:01,589 --> 01:52:59,679
it for our show next week we have dan

2846
01:53:04,390 --> 01:53:01,599
brew i like to have people that have not

2847
01:53:07,910 --> 01:53:04,400
been around the circuit and uh he will

2848
01:53:09,910 --> 01:53:07,920
be on uh a new person uh to talk about

2849
01:53:11,669 --> 01:53:09,920
uh ufos next week

2850
01:53:15,510 --> 01:53:11,679
and thank you all and we'll see you next

2851
01:53:24,640 --> 01:53:15,520
week keep your eyes to the sky